Wouldn't this be a good time for negotiations with the BATFE?

well it doesn't take a nostradamus to see whats coming down the pike..... and no I'm not "another Jerry"...... to be "another Jerry", I would have to sell motors through the mail and get a $40K fine....

shockie B)

A mind reader!

I should run a business based on that? Bwa ha ha

Al, I too will do whatever I have to in order to keep flying, though I'm not exactly rolling in dough. I've already spent plenty on getting my CA state license and renewing it every year. So far I've managed to keep up with that and the others costs of the hobby, but it kills me to waste money on stuff that serves no purpose other than to keep some worthless bureaucrats in power. It's not a "cost of the hobby", it's a power grab and backdoor taxation. All these government mandated "stepping stones" take money out of my pocket that would have been spent on rockets and motors. That's money our vendors will never receive, and I get nothing of value in return from the government.

Anything and everything available to us. Right now it's the lawsuit. The only thing I don't propose or accept is surrender.

As long as possible, and as much as we can. :) If we are beaten in the end, so be it. But it baffles me why people are already making plans/demands for surrender when we've just won a victory!

If they think these ATF regs are not onerous, they are clearly idiots. If they are demanding surrender even as the battle starts to go our way, they are cowards.

The NRA has it right -- no surrender, no quitting without a fight.

Rocketry may not be specfically mentioned in the Constitution, but remember that the Bill of Rights says our rights are not limited only those enumerated there.

This should be in the FAQ.

And rightfully so. We don't need any Neville Chamberlains in rocketry.

So what? I'd rather HAVE that 3-5 years of freedom (plus the 10 years we've already enjoyed) than just surrender without a fight. Man, how can you be so gutless?!?

If you think we're already beaten, why are you even in this hobby?? You might as well quit rocketry now, since eventually the ATF will find a way to outlaw it completely, right?

Good point!!

Those are not the only choices for HPR.

Joel. phx

Hey, if they trusted us, they wouldn't have to do background checks and fingerprints. The whole problem is that the government DOESN'T trust us, or any other United States citizens. That's why they make it so difficult and costly to get "authorization" for innocent activities.

What, hybrids? Hybrids are so extremely limiting, I don't really think of them as a viable option.

Homebrew candy motors are a more realistic option, but then that's amateur, not HPR.

Sometime you should try for a Top Secret security clearance. I know, it's not really relevant. It's just that the only person not to go over me was a gastroenterologist. The LEUP forms were a cakewalk.

And, before anyone really thinks that providing the information is too intrusive, you should take a long look at what happens to the information you give to get a credit card.

"shockwaveriderz" wrote in news:c6v1dv$g3fkt$ snipped-for-privacy@ID-222312.news.uni-berlin.de:

I suspect there are many other people like me, for whom the LEUP, stupid as it might be, is not the issue. It's the storage requirements. They're just not worth the trouble to be able to fly H and up.

len.

There is always RATT hybrids. They are reasonably simple to use and no LEUP required.

The storage requirement is inane and sad. It show cases the stupidity level of the BATF and the FBI and the Home Security boys. Everyone of my neighbors has a gallon or two of gasoline stored in their garages to use with their snow blowers or lawn equipment. A gallon of gasoline is impresive when it goes up, yet their is no problem with this or should we say that the above thugs are too cowardly to take on that group. They find it easier to gang on individuals which is their specialty. When you consider that the barbaque grill is attached to a propane tank and a spare isually kept in the garrage, one has to wonder just what goes on in the ganglion of the government.

Perhaps an old timer I knew understood it best. He said the best "Texas Rangers had been ex robbers and killers and vice versa." After the Soviet Union collapsed many of the KGB and police became thugs and joined fairly nasty gangs that continue the time honored tradition of terrorizing the defensless. We are dealing with low IQ thugs who in all likelyhood can not make a living outside of what they are doing. They are doing what they do best bothering people and accomplishing nothing and making those they burden pay for it. The only good news is that they at least have to give a show that they are following the rules which gives the average citizen some protection. These people are about as useful as any extortion ring. They are like a tapeworm feeding off of the host. All the poor host can hope for is that the parasite won't kill it.

Will the BATF, FBI and Home Security boys kill amateur rocketry? It depends on how smart the tapeworm is and histrory shows tapeworms as being pretty stupid.