Enstone

"John" wrote (snip):-

Did anyone spot the engine on a stand in the corner opposite the entrance? I can't remember the name but it was made in Coventry. Asking price was £300. No carb or ignition system but everything else looked good.

John

Was it the two cylinder White and Poppe? Been offered for a while now, must say I didn't ralise he was only asking £300 though. To put that in perspective someone else was trying to sell a Norman T300 for £350 - I'm pretty sure he took it home with him though!

That's the one.

That's the one.

It's probably an automotive engine of around 1910, a time when most car manufacturers were basically assemblers of bought-in parts, including of course engines. Singer used W&P engines, as did the first Morris Oxford. 300 quid seems reasonable to me given it's rarity, mind you finding an early light car chassis to suit could be a challenge!

I enjoyed Enstone though bought very little of consequence. Saw P. T-E and and Dan Howden, plus Kim from afar, lunch in Burford then a slow drive down through Lechlade and home on the M4.

White & Poppe it was. It is very odd that this substantial, unusual and technically interesting engine has not been snapped up, but it was for sale at the Sodbury Sort out this time last year & is still going the rounds. Strange.

Photos at

I had a bit of an odd day, really. There wasn't anything to really interest me - I might have bought a set of old alkaline cells, but he wouldn't drop a fiver at twenty five quid, so I walked away - not that keen ...

There was a magneto that I'd have liked, but he too would not entertain a penny off the price, so he got to keep it - may it profit him ;o))

A Villiers Century with no spark was offered at £50 which would have been OK with a spark, but Villiers stuff is getting expensive to fix now. I noticed it had gone on my second sweep, however. He also had some interesting old electronic and lab. gear for sale, but either wanted too much for it was too incomplete to be worthwhile.

Elsewhere, I found a dirty & scruffy lab DC supply unit for a whole three quid. I had no real expectations of it apart from useful bits, but it works perfectly! As I'm building up a new PA for society use & as we run it off a commercial generator, I am delighted to have a VERY smooth low voltage supply with which to run it.

A hand cranking magneto with a missing points end was a tenner (I've got the bits) and a hand-held Geiger counter to add to my growing collection of War Dept electronic stuff - Not only does it work, but the 9 Volt batteries are in good condition!

Finally, I'd bought a Coventry-Victor MA2 off Mac McGowan on Ebay & he was kind enough to take it to Enstone for me. Anyway, when I saw it in the flesh, I realised at once that it is not the 300cc MA2 but the far more substantial 750cc AF2. This was a pity as all I really wanted was the tinware and the magneto coupling. It didn't cost a lot, mind ... C-V's are hefty things anyway & I could not lift it off the ground unaided. Together, Mac and I perched it on the lip of the BMW's boot (into which, it should be said, an MA2 readily fits!) and by dint of removing the magneto and some of the governor stuff, I managed to wriggle it in - well, mostly. I tied the boot lid to the tow bar & so headed north for the committee meeting I had to attend in the afternoon. It was a little unnerving at first, but once I got used to the tail weight, I concluded the 150 mile round trip without incident. My next door neighbour gave me a lift out of the boot & removing the centrifugal clutch made a big difference to the weight. It was sold as partially seized & it certainly appeared solid enough, but a spanner on the crankshaft nut moved it at once and some Plus Gas in the plug 'oles soon had it in motion. As it only has compression one side, I suspect a valve has stuck open. Otherwise, as smooth as a smooth thing ;o))

Hazel was actually quite sympathetic to my plight & readily acknowledged that they looked very similar .

I saw Roland, PT-E, Dan Howden and Steve, but missed Nick although his presence was reported!

Regards,

Kim Siddorn

It is really getting too commercial these days. I was talking with Arthur G on the telling bone when your post came up on the computer, and we both agreed that unless there is something to actually go and look out for, the resulting cost of fuel etc makes it an expensive day or morning out.

We haven't been to a Sodbury do since the last one held in Sodbury itself and have yet to make it to Enstone. There is always something else to do or spend the money on!

The other thing is that much of what we have been involved with recently has come our way without going hunting for it. The Caterpillar 1Y73 engines (found a new contact for these at Caterpillar HQ) and recently a possible Nordberg 4FD1 emerged that might be coming over the water, depending on shipping costs to the UK.

Martin P is without internet at present as his system went awry last week, we are dropping a broadband modem and software over to his place via No1 son tonight, together with some bits for the Petter W1 engines that he got when we moved the Caterpillars.

Peter

-- Peter A Forbes Prepair Ltd, Luton, UK snipped-for-privacy@easynet.co.uk

"Kim Siddorn" wrote (snip):-

I guess it's a case of what do you do with it once you've got it. I initially thought light car, but Looking at your pics, I wonder if it's original application may in fact have been marine given the low slung mounts and flywheel with no sign of a missing cone clutch?

I looked at that battery (the stall was Terry Lines and Stan Mills') - thought it was a NiFe at first but, though virtually identical, the manufacturer's plate bore another, unfamiliar, name. Would look good with a coil ignited O/C engine or something, but I couldn't think of an immediate use for it. Assuming it is the same chemistry as NiFe - would one expect it to be ok after an indeterminate number of years of use and probably abuse?

I didn't think the price was too bad, must say I half thought you'd bought it! This was was quite unmistakably marked 'The Century Unit' , yet others appear to be identified as 100cc Mar-Vil units - is there a differance?

.

Looks too good to build into a PA, I wouldn't be without a variable PSU in the workshop.

Oops! Still, I'm sure it will feel at home with all the other flat twins!

"Prepair Ltd" wrote (snip):-

Must say I rate a morning picking over old iron and assorted other junk as good entertainment even without any specific 'wants'.

BTW do you know anything about the longevity or otherwise of NiFe cells Peter?

I'd thought the W&P was a marine, too.

I did have a good stare at the Villiers Century, but I have one already with the sexy silencer. Dunno if they are different.

I was under the impression that alkaline batteries have an indefinite life. Certainly a venerable 10volt example I have already takes & holds a charge.

I'd not build in the Lab. PSU, just cart it about separately. Looks like an expensive bit of kit .......

Regards,

Kim Siddorn

Diplomacy done, plates spun, fires fought, maidens eaten - well, three out of four ain't bad

Depends on what other things you have on at the time. 'Play' time is in very short supply at present, so although we were going to go to Enstone right up until Friday evening, we made the decision not to go on Saturday early on and got some more stuff out ready for the next skip. I think after a week of driving, I look forward to a weekend doing something/anything else... Ended up going to Hinckley and Nottingham on Sunday afternoon after the F1 GP, 200 mile round trip with all the bits and pieces thrown in, and had the A6 closed at Finedon on the way back :-((

I suppose I should include the time spent on the website additions as playtime, although sometimes after a session of scanning and cleaning up my eyeballs feel like peeled onions!

They tend to exhibit the same characteristics as Nickel-cadmium batteries and use the same alkaline electrolyte. They will stand uncharged for some considerable time with no ill-effects, and an electrolyte change after a few years can work wonders. They do eventually fall over though...

We have been putting new 110V substation batteries in recently, 200AH Lead-Acid types with individual cells. They are nearly 40 years old some of them, a life spent on float charge with little work done.

Peter

-- Peter A Forbes Prepair Ltd, Luton, UK snipped-for-privacy@easynet.co.uk

"Prepair Ltd" wrote (snip):-

Rest assured the results are appreciated! Thanks for info on NiFe batteries, I thought if anyone knew you would.

Oh, BTW, the ex eBay scruffy Norman Mk1 T300 which the lady was asking £350 for at Enstone was £400 at Sodbury.

Lemesee now, at that rate, how soon will it be twenty five quid which is about what it's worth? I bet she buries it rather than be seen to be that far out in her estimate of its value ;o))

Regards,

"Kim Siddorn" wrote (snip):-

Tried to sell on ebay or aquired there?

former ;o))

Regards,

Kim Siddorn

Ah, I thought they might have been trying to recover the cost of an unfortunate ebay experience! I was lurking as negotiations with a prospective purchaser were underway, and the guy was quite adamant that he would not drop below £300.

If he spent some time and energy cleaning it up and applying a decent coat of paint, he might get somewhere near it. A T300 in original condition with those sexy finned pipes fetched over £200

and I noticed a T600 - which are admittedly more unusual - fetched £255.

Regards,

Kim Siddorn

Diplomacy done, plates spun, fires fought, maidens eaten - well, three out of four ain't bad

'Twas I that spent what seemed like an exorbitant amount on the T600 but I think it was a good buy. I've spent about 3 years trying to find one that was at least largely complete but unless I've just been unlucky they seem rarer than rocking horse doo-doos.

This one has a few relatively minor bits missing that (with the exception of the air filter/choke arrangement) are easily made or otherwise replaced. All in all a very nicely restored item.

It's a bit of a brute to start though. Ideally needs a four foot starting handle to get it through the compression stroke but other than the noise causing the neighbours' cat to give birth it runs like a champ (whatever one of those may be).

Regards

Mark

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Landrover type thingy made by Austin :o)

Large 4-wheel drive vehicle produced by Austin in the 1950's ?

Used to have one, horribly expensive on fuel but superbly comfortable on those torsion bars and big tyres :-))

Peter

-- Peter & Rita Forbes Email: snipped-for-privacy@easynet.co.uk Web:

The Champ had torsion bar suspension? Didn't know that.

I had a Mercedes 306D van that had leaf springs held in torsion for the front suspension & ordinary ones at the rear. It was s-l-o-w & you could hear it muttering "lorry-lorry-lorry" as it went along. Dropped a valve once & the engine continued to run (noisily) for over 100 miles, simply pushing the valve up and down without damage to either party. Took all the carbon of the valve head!

Regards,

Kim Siddorn