So should I pass it on ?

Bought a Hornby Duchess a few months ago, from a trade stand at a train
fayre. was a good price £60 and just the one I wanted - Duchess of
Buccleuch. Loco and box in mint condition. Had never met seller but had nice
chat, complemented him on his prices. Talked about other traders that we
both know so he was aware I could find him again.
Gave it a run recently (been busy), bit rough, clicked and wobbled. So
emptied ashtrays, cleaned windscreen - it became more wobbly and jammed.
Carefully took wheels and valve gear off, checked ok, checked btb, checked
quartering cleaned everything, put back together. It got worse. Stripped it
down again, got as far as motor off, gears out. No problem found except bit
of rough metal on one coupling rod. Back to .... worse still. Body off, turn
upside down connect wires, stare at it for long time at different motor
speeds. Stopped/clicked at same place, sometimes jammed.
Success, rod in one cylinder hitting slight ridge.
So what do I do ?
Try and fix it. Buy new chassis ? Send to be fixed (£20-30 perhaps). Display
it ?
Sell it with warning to trader (£20 perhaps). Sell it without (£30 perhaps).
Sell it on ebay - at least £50.
What gets me is why do people sell these things knowing that theres
something wrong with them. "Test Run" - well moved 3 feet on straight. "Good
Runner" didnt derail in test. Mint in box - crap runner. "Box not opened"
well the chap I got it from muttered something about a problem so i didnt
test it.
Isnt this supposed to be a nice, friendly hobby. Why do people (who are not
poor)want to screw someone for a few quid. Do they feel good about it ?
I've already decided what to do - commited to it. But what does the team
think ? What are your experiences ?
Simon
ps, no John this is not about hornby QC, bachmann are just as bad (or good).
Thats a different thread !
Nor is it about that snotty internet/mail order shop that sells returns as
new.
Finally, I dont know it was sold with the knowledge there was a problem, not
accusing on here, will wait till I see the bloke and see what he says.
Reply to
simon
Loading thread data ...
"simon" wrote
I for one can't answer that, but in the 25 years that I've made my living from this hobby I have to say that I've seen it all.
I remember on my first ever visit to Hornby in the days when they still manufactured in Margate, questioning them about quality control.
"Every single loco we make is tested before it is shipped out." I was assured, but that didn't explain why we'd had two identical locos supplied by them without motors.
Or why the chap who bought a loco from a local swapmeet at Beverley and couldn't get the loco to work which he was assured had been tested and worked fine. It was a Hornby tender-drive 'Flying Scotsman' which had been sold with a Tri-ang loco-drive tender.
Or the old woman who returned a loco to us and demanded a refund because it was faulty. When I remonstrated and said she hadn't bought it from us, she swore blind she had. Strange that it had another retailer's price label on the box.
I've lost count at the number of people who have brought faulty locos purchased on eBay into my shop for repair. All of which (of course) had been tested and were described as being in good running order.
I'll not name the well known UK retailer, the principle of which was convicted of 'receiving stolen goods' nicked from another nearby model shop. Although in recent years I believe that individual has genuinely reformed and is now pretty well respected.
I guess at the end of the day there are crooks or dishonest people in every walk of life, and whilst I'm sure not all go out of their way to deceive, some certainly do. There are traders who perhaps cannot afford to lose the money they legitimately paid out for a used model which turned out to be faulty and are willing to pass their loss on to someone else. And of course there are others who simply claim to have tested something, but clearly have not - and haven't we all done that as an expediency at some time or other?
John.
Reply to
John Turner
Thank you for that, it made me laugh ! Nice to know that theyre not just out to get me.
Simon
Reply to
simon
So do you pass it on ? Depends if you have a conscience ? ( sounds like you have ) Why do people sell these things knowing that there is something wrong with them ?
Simple, because they don't want it to come out of their pocket and as the hobby is getting more & more expansive it's going to happen more frequently !
Isn't this supposed to be a nice, friendly hobby ?
I feel, in the most part, it is but you always get one or two that spoil it. I get items from model exhibitions and displays for our son's railway. He had been after a single level crossing so was pleased to find one at a reasonable price on a club members stall. Paid the money then we went for a cut of tea ... opened the box to find over half of kit missing so took it back and after a 'brief exchange of words' got my son's money back.
As for loco's I now carry a 12v battery pack in the car to check locos run at these exhibitions and displays.
On the other side of the coin I remember getting a couple of tank engine's from a stall in a local market and he tested them prior to sale.
As for Ebay, I feel that the prices some people pay on the site for railway models etc. is ridiculous and in the long term may harm the hobby.
Reply to
Dragon Heart
"Dragon Heart" wrote
Don't confuse the model railway enthusiast with the collectors' market. The two are completely different beasts occasionally chasing the same product.
There's a certain element of 'urban myth' regarding the prices paid on eBay. Certainly in over 500 transactions on that august forum, I've seen people (occasionally) pay silly prices, but sadly on my own listings that's only happened once or twice, so I'm still looking for the complete clown willing to make my fortune by paying a king's ransome for an every-day item.
John.
Reply to
John Turner
This type of 'urban myth' often ends up causing problems. People want a bargain or to make a huge amount cos someone else has done that. Not allowed to have a simple transaction - buy/sell something at a reasonable price. We're the instant gratification generation.
Let me know when you're listing something, every time i bid someone comes along and whacks some daft offer in.
Simon
Reply to
simon
In message , simon writes
I buy all my British-outline locos mail order from a trader who tests things properly before sending them out (except the stuff I get from the Bachmann Collectors' Club, obviously, and I've had no trouble with them, either).
Reply to
Jane Sullivan
"simon" wrote
Currently I'm only disposing of some of my own personal collection of model trains, and apart from a couple of items finishing tomorrow night I've about done for now.
I shall start listing 'Christmas Bargains' for the shop from the end of November, but I don't advertise those on here.
John.
Reply to
John Turner
It sounds like you've had a lot more 'play value' from your purchase than if you had just been able to stick it on the track and run it round a few times - I expect you would have soon got bored.
And it's given you something to talk about with your friends on here.
Perhaps faulty engines should command a premium price.
:-)
Alan
Reply to
Alan P Dawes
John, I'm not in your business but is it like the video business where people living on the social open stalls at trade fairs every week and undercut all the regular dealers?
(kim)
Reply to
kim
I do enjoy fiddling with poor/non runners to get them going, but not a mint Duchess - am just not that good. Why would anyone get bored watching a Duchess loop ? Faulty engines do command a premium price - aka Mint in Box.
Simon
Reply to
simon
"kim" wrote
John, I'm not in your business but is it like the video business where people living on the social open stalls at trade fairs every week and undercut all the regular dealers?
Don't know, but I suspect those that trade at swapmeets and some on eBay are the same.
" people living on the social " It that not a little bit of typecasting ?
Ebay are encountering problems of rouge traders selling counterfeit goods and based on press reports do not appear to be doing much about it proactively.
It's the old saying " buyer beware " that comes to mind.
model railways, which is a pity for the younger generation or those on limited incomes, if I win the Euro millions jackpot next week I think I will set up a model railway company who make simple, no frills loco's, carriages & wagons for those on a tight budget.
Reply to
Dragon Heart
I have to buy via Internet and find ebay lives up to what I grew to expect of life in the UK when I was in business. This played a large part in my choosing to migrate on retirement. Of my last 5 purchases via ebay, non were runners or as advertised. One trader refunded my money instantly. I take pleasure from remedying the defects and then informing the seller (by email to prevent fB backlash) that they have failed to rip me off!! How childish of me but what gives me pleasure.
I go into this with my eyes open. Often, having repaired something, I resell it but carrying a true description and it usually makes the same price. The lowest prices have been made on the best quality which I have sold as inapproprite to me . I suppose that my wee free attitude to honesty precludes me from selling rubbish unless it is labled as such.
I have succeeded just once in setting the law onto an abay thief but that takes a bit of doing as there is no promotion in such unspectacular activities even if it is big business in the theft economy.
eBay themeselves do not act fast enough -- a 30 day cooling off period is followed by the 60 day cut off and most rogue traders manage to hold out that long so shielding themselves from public condamnation on ebay.
Reply to
Peter Abraham
"Dragon Heart" wrote
Type-casting or not, I do know of people 'on benefit' who trade at swapmeets and on eBay. Equally so I know of any number of swapmeet &/or eBay traders who have full time jobs and do not declare their 'hobby trading' activities to the tax authorities.
John.
Reply to
John Turner
It's a widespread practice and one which the courts fail to take seriously. A local man was sentenced to just 240 hours community service after claiming £75,000 in incapacity and other benefits while working five days a week at car boot sales. That is money which would otherwise be paid to people in genuine need. I see similar examples practically every day.
(kim)
Reply to
kim
But this is the problem. It doesnt/shouldnt need to be buyer beware. Non-runner locos are one of the hardest thing for most people to spot. There are genuine MIBs and genuine mistakes. Plus with some locos the problem is only found during a test that includes a decent measure of curve - both ways and there are also the ones that develop over time.
Ebay is a seperate subject (as shown many times), you are on your own there, survival is just protection as part of the herd. Like car boot sales it was a good idea thats been hijacked by a certain type of trader who is determined to take every few pence available. Also the competition too often is more important than the end result - item purchase/sale.
OK so I want to be in a fairy tale land where everything is as described except for genuine errors. I dont mind and wherever possible I'll deal with like minded people.
Simon

Reply to
simon

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