FINGER follow up.

Too bad you already posted that it was completly operator error.
John
Reply to
john
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Hum - Let me explain a little about this type of job. For 11 years I was senior Adjunct (a.k.a. part time) professor at a Jr. College. There is a full time day staff that has Department Heads (often non-teaching) and sometimes other unique titles depending on the conditions. Senior Lead teacher is often the day time next in line or trying to keep up to be. Part time instructors and professors are just that, above dirt, just above the students. We were easy come easy go. (in a way). If classes were down, night takes the hit until night is limited then full day types have their classes split day night and that keeps the night program (more money... ) running with fewer and fewer.
From time to time, we or our students might come by some deal, but typically it was the day types that get the call e.g. the Department head gets a call or gets a message from the 'head shed' that a shipment of xxxx is coming on yyy with some stuff...
The best one of these was when the schools trucks went to a military surplus site that allowed schools first pick then the rest could be sold to salvage or surplus companies. The truck came back with all kinds of stuff and junk. I had to identify some of it as the day people had no idea what it was much less what it could do. I called the MP's at the local Sac Base to come pick up some B-52 grade Magnatrons. They still had the special encoding wheels used in the sweep frequency modes. They were still secret and radioactive. {I was in Electronics training B52 Design engineers (tubes...) to F-111 designers (solid state)}
So in short, one never really knows what one gets or why it was dumped. And the day people are really in charge of everything.
Martin
Reply to
Martin H. Eastburn
I suspect that your lawyer will advise you that you cannot sue the school. That's the trade off workers made to get the benefits of a worker's compensation system.
Worker's compensation pays regardless of who was at fault, as long as the employee was acting within the scope of his employment. Worker negligence is no defense for the employer. But neither is employer negligence a basis for any claim greater than the statutory (or regulatory) sum for a given injury. If you are covered by worker's compensation, your medical costs should be paid and you will receive an additional lump-sum payment. And that most likely will be the end of it.
Dale Scroggins
Reply to
Dale Scroggins
Budda bing.."operators discretion"
Does that ring a chord?
Gunner
Confronting Liberals with the facts of reality is very much akin to clubbing baby seals. It gets boring after a while, but because Liberals are so stupid it is easy work." Steven M. Barry
Reply to
Gunner
But they used it with with broken safety switches that the machine was designed to have operational. And knew before they ever threw the juice to it that those switches were toast and to operate it in such a condition was unsafe.
Look, Im not on Ernies ass about his medical bills. After all, it did happen in their employment, and as such, it would be proper. Workmans Comp at the least.
But Punative Damages yada yada yada..thats another story and that was what I was commenting on. If he is ONLY trying to recover his medical expenses, and perhaps lost wages, Ive absolutely no problem with that. As I said..it was an On The Job Injury and one that occured while he was on the clock
The ONLY negligence demonstrated at this point, was Ernies. Shrug. getting all touchy feely and blaming some mindless beauracrat for his screw up is, frankly, unethical and disingenious.
Punative damages is Punishment for negligence or intentional harm. None of which can be laid at the door of the school. Hell, might as well try to hit Boeing as they gave them a defective press.
And hell yes we have all taken shortcuts. Unsafe ones. Some REALLY unsafe ones. Im just as guilty as anyone else about this. I try really really hard to find safe workarounds, but sometimes there are no options other than to never turn on the machine. Which is what Ernie should have done, as it turns out. Sometimes we are in a hurry, or too lazy to do things right. But you have to live with your actions.
As someones sig says so well....
"Sometimes fate hits you with the Clown Hammer of Circumstance and there's nothing to do but sit there and watch the little birds fly around your head."
Gunner
Confronting Liberals with the facts of reality is very much akin to clubbing baby seals. It gets boring after a while, but because Liberals are so stupid it is easy work." Steven M. Barry
Reply to
Gunner
Would those be the facts that Ernie gave in his first post? Or did you ignore those?
Gunner
Confronting Liberals with the facts of reality is very much akin to clubbing baby seals. It gets boring after a while, but because Liberals are so stupid it is easy work." Steven M. Barry
Reply to
Gunner
Ernie typed a total of 3 sentences explaining how he injured himself in his first post. He mentioned nothing, one way or the other, about whether he was required to use that press or any other factors that may or may not make the school culpable.
Here's a link to Ernie's first post on the subject:
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I'm not saying that I know all of the details of what happened or if Ernie was pressured into using that press in an unsafe condition, or even whether he was trying to fix the safety mechanism when the accident happened. After all, how *could* I know without having been there?
What I AM saying is that *you don't know either*. You've had to resort to analogies and presumptions all throughout this thread. Your analogies have not been accurate and your presumptions have been, well, *presumptions*.
I don't know how you can make a judgment while knowing so few of the facts about the accident and the surrounding circumstances.
Fools rush in, Gunner....
Reply to
Artemia Salina
This one...
No we removed a dead CNC controller and restored manual controls, however the palm buttons got desroyed in shipping from Boeing and I couldn't get the school to shell out money to restore them.
We counted ourselves lucky to have a big press with a foot controller. Believe me, if I had really thought it through at the time I would have fought harder, but the constant wail of the admins at school is "money, money, money".
Now I am having trouble even finding a electrician in Seattle who will wire up safety controlls.
The school has asked me to get an estimate for making the machine safer.
Yes they do. Even those who have reading comprehension problems.
Gunner
Confronting Liberals with the facts of reality is very much akin to clubbing baby seals. It gets boring after a while, but because Liberals are so stupid it is easy work." Steven M. Barry
Reply to
Gunner
My personal opinion: you should get any and all compensation that is available for your loss. Any less and you will feel cheated in the long run. Regardless of whom is at fault, it was you that suffered the loss and you should be compensated for it. To put anything in perspective, imagine anything that happened to yourself as happening to someone else you care about and then what would you do about it.
Reply to
ff
"Artemia Salina" wrote
It is a well known fact that it is easy for one to find assumptions, statistics, and opinions to support one's conclusion. A reasonable man does it the other way arround, forming the conclusion last.
HTH
Steve
Reply to
SteveB
Exactly, that is the reason workmans comp exists. You waive (in almost all cases) the right to sue an employer for negligence when you enter workmans comp. Some states allow a worker to opt out of workmans comp, and retain the right to sue, but the provision is used very, very seldom. And good luck finding an employer that wants to hire you if you opt out. Any third rate ambulance chaser (or a business owner that's actually read the policy) can tell you this.
JTMcC.
Reply to
JTMcC
You are correct that whatever body part is lost there is a scale on how much of a payout there is for the missing part. But from what you have said you have a cause of action against the school in addition to what the loss of your fingertips might be. If the employer was negligent in any way they are liable for damages. You would be justified in seeking compensation for damages both compensatory and punative. That means a lawsuit against a negligent employer would be worth considerably more than just the value of your missing parts. You definitely need the services of a personal injury lawyer.
Remember too, everyone hates lawyers. That is until they are injured by someone eles's negligence. Then they find out how much they actually like them.
Hawke
Reply to
Hawke
What state allows you to sue your employer? I don't know of any. Workmans comp is exclusive remedy. Like someone already said, Work. Comp imposes strict liability, meaning you get benifits without determining fault or neglegence. And, employers are granted immunity from claims by employees, and co workers as well. The upside to all of this is that people who get hurt on the job due to their own actions get benifits. If you could sue the employer for negligence, then he could sue you as well. I'm no lawyer of course but I do try to understand why and for what I'm paying money to the state funds for.
JTMcC.
Reply to
JTMcC
"> > Hawke
It's generally true, workmen's comp is a trade-off. Fault is not an issue, if you get hurt on the job, you are compensated. The trade is that you get paid according to the schedule; none of this bullshit about loss of consortium, pain and suffering, etc., etc. Only questions: how much were your medical bills, what part did you lose (or what percentage of the use of that part), and consequently what percentage less are you capable of earning from here on out? Of course, this is all State Law specific, some variances, but that's the general theory. The big $ comes from "third party actions". That's where you go after someone other than your employer (after you take the WC). Typical defendants are manufacturers of the machine, dealers who sold it, or some other outside person who either modified it or in other ways compromised it to interfere with its safe operation. Not a WC lawyer, much less a Washington attorney, but I don't see much of that here. At least talk to a comp lawyer, it's a complicated process at best, and an experienced guy will make sure you get the best outcome. Most States, by the way, regulate lawyers' fees on WC, and sometimes the employer bears part of that cost.
But, Ernie, I wish you the best. I'm primarily a lurker, but over the last 2-3 years, I made no move regarding the purchase or use of welding related things before I went into the archives and checked if you had anything to say about it. Good luck and recover totally.
Ed
Reply to
Ed Butrym
The first thing a lawyer would say is for you to stop posting about it. These posts could be used against you. I have a friend who teaches machine shop in San Diego. It's really a bummer watching the city cut all the shop programs because they can't afford to insure them all, but thats how it is today. He won't allow the use of an improperly equipped machine by anyone, he has a few donated machines waiting for safety equipment.
Reply to
Paul Calman
Can you cite a court case where Usenet posts were submitted as evidence?
Reply to
ff
Hey, I'm no lawyer, but admitting (partial or full) fault or responsibility in any recorded method could be damaging to a case. Cardinal Richelieu said that one should never commit to writing anything that can later be used against you.
Perhaps Ernie should sue just to force the school to pay attention to safety. If one was totally altruistic in this instance, he could donate an award to a suitable charity, or even back to the school in the form of equipment and supplies.
Reply to
Paul Calman

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