Last one out please turn off the lights........

============ You missed my point.

Its not what I think, or what you think, or what Gunner or Cliff thinks, that is important in this context: its what the Islamic fundamentalist thinks. [His/Her] perception *IS* reality, and they act on/from that reality.

Unka George (George McDuffee) ..................................................................... The arbitrary rule of a just and enlightened prince is always bad. His virtues are the most dangerous and the surest form of seduction: they lull a people imperceptibly into the habit of loving, respecting, and serving his successor, whoever that successor may be, no matter how wicked or stupid.

Denis Diderot (1713-84), French philosopher. Refutation of Helvétius (written 1773-76; first published 1875; repr. in Selected Writings, ed. by Lester G. Crocker, 1966).

============ This seems to be an occupational hazard of people in power, whether industry or government.

Promises are easy/cheap to make but frequently difficult to fulfill. However the government of England seems to have raised the to an art form, particularly when the other parties skin was darker.

BTW -- Arabs are not the only ones taking it in the shorts. See the many threads on pension screw-jobs here in the US.

When you don't want to do something there are always a million ready-made excuses/rationales why you can't.

"Put not thy trust in Princes" remains extremely good advise, and get the money up-front....

Unka George (George McDuffee) ..................................................................... The arbitrary rule of a just and enlightened prince is always bad. His virtues are the most dangerous and the surest form of seduction: they lull a people imperceptibly into the habit of loving, respecting, and serving his successor, whoever that successor may be, no matter how wicked or stupid.

Denis Diderot (1713-84), French philosopher. Refutation of Helvétius (written 1773-76; first published 1875; repr. in Selected Writings, ed. by Lester G. Crocker, 1966).

=========== Yes, and it will only intensify between now and the first Tuesday after the second Monday in November, at which point the discussion will shift to problems with electronic/computer voting, as in "WE WAS ROBBED!!!!!!!"

People in metalworking tend to have a lot of interests and experience in other areas, and can see how the metalworking trades interact with many other factors. They are also not shy and don't mind sharing their opinions/experences.

Remember that all advise and suggestions you get through usenet are worth at least twice what you pay for them, and you get triple your money back if not completely satisfied....

Unka George (George McDuffee) ..................................................................... The arbitrary rule of a just and enlightened prince is always bad. His virtues are the most dangerous and the surest form of seduction: they lull a people imperceptibly into the habit of loving, respecting, and serving his successor, whoever that successor may be, no matter how wicked or stupid.

Denis Diderot (1713-84), French philosopher. Refutation of Helvétius (written 1773-76; first published 1875; repr. in Selected Writings, ed. by Lester G. Crocker, 1966).

sounds like your the one whining

BTW, Tony, it's "sounds like YOU'RE the one whining" ... You're is a contraction for you are. Your indicates possession, as your name or your property.

Plus, no capitalization, and no punctuation mark.

What state did you NOT go to school in? Or haven't you reached this lesson yet in middle school? Perhaps if you would have learned English, you could write a Job Safety Analysis, or an In Progress Evaluation, or any number of documents that would take you out of the dead end labor job you are in.

Go back to school. It's never too late, unless you are just ignorant. Ignorance is the condition of a person who REFUSES to learn.

Steve

I don't think I did.

It's not what all those, including the Islamic fundamentalist thinks. It's what _enough_ people think all at once, whatever their bent. I contend that if the conditions didn't suck for the entire populace the fundamentalists would just be a few isolated loonies. Instead the conditions are bad that otherwise rational people are being lead down the garden path.

See Germany, 1922 - 1942 (or so).

piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan piss and moan

I just wanted to get in on the conversation.

Steve

P e r s o n a l l y

l i k e

s i d e

p o s t i n g .

Hey Steve,

My son is currently on a waiting list to get into the 1yr welding program at Madison Area Tech College here in WI. He applied this summer and was told the fall of 2007 would be his next chance. We had a discussion of the schools facilities and program with the dept head. He told us that he received a letter from the State of Iowa that says they need 200 welders NOW and wanted to give graduating students the oportunity to find work. The teacher says he has nearly 100% job placement in the field for grad students.

The real bummer is that the welding program here only graduates 30 or students a year. They don't have the staff to run a new class in the spring and fall. They decide to add teaching staff to the "Arts" and such.

I told the kid, join the Navy. He didn't want to commit to 4 year "school".

Brian