Questions on Welding 1" HRS Plate

I have an upcoming hobby project that I was hoping to get some advise on. I'm going to be welding a 6" x 12" x 1" hot rolled steel plate to another 8" x 12" x 1" HRS plate to make a large angle plate for my milling machine. The weld will be made along the 12" dimension.

The welder I will be using is my old AC-225 (AC only) stick welder. This is by far the heaviest weld I've ever done and I'm going for a really good quality, full-penetration weld.

My thinking is that I should butt the vertical plate against the horizontal one for a fillet weld on the topside and a butt weld on the underside. Is this a sound idea? Does it matter?

Assuming that the weldments will be fitted up that way, should I put a vee in the underside, and if so, how deep should I go with it? (this will be easy to accomplish on the milling machine)

I have a bunch of old 1/8" 6013 rod. I suspect that this is not the optimum rod to use. What would be a better choice (oh, and I guess I should mention that I can't supply more than 30 amps input to the welder, so I can't achieve its full output amperage. I'm not sure what my max output would be before popping the breaker)?

Is there anything else I should consider, or is this not a doable project with my equipment and novice skill?

Thanks very much!

Reply to
Artemia Salina
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Fit them so they just touch on the inside corner, and weld the outside corner solid. This will pull the plates quite a bit. In fact, your biggest problem isn't going to be getting a strong corner, it will be getting a square one. If it were me, I'd fit 45° gussets at both ends and weld them really solid *before* welding the outside corner. | | | | A|_____| --------- B | | ---------C

In other words, weld up the outer angle solid. This is shown as triangle ABC above.

GWE

Artemia Sal> I have an upcoming hobby project that I was hoping to get

Reply to
Grant Erwin

Thanks Grant. That looks like a very good way to do it. I agree on the gussets. I was thinking of doing that too, since I'll want "handles" for this beast anyway. I think I have some 1" diameter round stock that I can use. If not I'll get some thick wall pipe and use that.

Noodling around on the net last night, looking for proper electrodes, I think 7014 should be a good choice.

Reply to
Artemia Salina

I doubt you have any need for a full penetration weld since it is an angle plate. I would set your plates so that you have one lapping over by a quarter inch to a max of three eighths. Put your gussets in and tack weld every thing up. Move around so that you are welding on the open corner, the inside corner and your gussets. If you intend to do it the way you mentioned I would grind/machine a bevel on one corner of one of the plates. 1/4 by 1/4 deep should be enough. That way you will have a groove to weld into . When you machine the faces true there will still be weld holding the angle plate on the outside.

As long as you are not cooling the thing rapidly you can use just about any rod you like. 1/8 inch 6013 would be fine. You won't need preheat because your angle plate is so small. It will be piping hot when you are done. I am guessing that you will be machining afterward??? Let the item cool as slowly as possible. You don't want any hard spots that the machinist might find. They have been known to take the piece out of the machine and throw it at the welder :')) It would be pretty difficult to pop a 30 amp breaker with 1/8 rod... NO worries. Don't exceed your duty cycle rating. By the time you chip and clean between each rod you should be OK My guess you can run continuous at around 80 amps and you likely will be running 125. If your rod is running right you should be able to knock the flux off with one hit. If you have it too hot you will see lots of spatter and you will have to chip like crazy to get that baked on flux off. Randy

I have an upcoming hobby project that I was hoping to get some advise on. I'm going to be welding a 6" x 12" x 1" hot rolled steel plate to another 8" x 12" x 1" HRS plate to make a large angle plate for my milling machine. The weld will be made along the 12" dimension.

The welder I will be using is my old AC-225 (AC only) stick welder. This is by far the heaviest weld I've ever done and I'm going for a really good quality, full-penetration weld.

My thinking is that I should butt the vertical plate against the horizontal one for a fillet weld on the topside and a butt weld on the underside. Is this a sound idea? Does it matter?

Assuming that the weldments will be fitted up that way, should I put a vee in the underside, and if so, how deep should I go with it? (this will be easy to accomplish on the milling machine)

I have a bunch of old 1/8" 6013 rod. I suspect that this is not the optimum rod to use. What would be a better choice (oh, and I guess I should mention that I can't supply more than 30 amps input to the welder, so I can't achieve its full output amperage. I'm not sure what my max output would be before popping the breaker)?

Is there anything else I should consider, or is this not a doable project with my equipment and novice skill?

Thanks very much!

Reply to
R. Zimmerman

What Randy said; I'd add:

1) Keep in mind that you are not going for penetration, you are going for good buildup and adhesion to the last layer. You will likely have 10 to 15 passes of weld bead. Nice uniform beads are preferred to "burning it in" 2) Offset the plates about 1/4" so you minimize the material you have to add. Beveling out the edges will allow full penetration 3) 6013 is a great rod for this. Nice soft arc, well behaved slag. If you do it just right, the slag will lift off the weld about 8" behind your active weld zone. 4) This thing will warp. It will curl up like a cat in the sun. Let it walk to where it wants to be, cool it slowly. Don't be surprised if the 1" shrinks to 3/4" or less when it is machined. 5) I think I'd bump up to 5/32" 6013 running at about 130 amps. It shouldn't hit your duty cycle or breaker capacity, it will cut down significantly on the weld time. 6) If you are try> I doubt you have any need for a full penetration weld since it is an angle
Reply to
RoyJ

"R. Zimmerman" wrote: (clip) If you have it too hot you will see lots of spatter and you will have to chip like crazy to get that baked on flux off. (clip) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Mind answering a question from a self-taught, shade-tree, buzz box welder? Is that generally true, that flux that's hard to chip is a sign of too much heat?

Reply to
Leo Lichtman

It is an indication that something is wrong. When you have the right heat and lay down a nice straight bead the flux will "fingernail" off as it cools. 6013, 7014 and 7018 will do this when everything is right. Something is wrong when you have to pound like crazy. Guys who are good often only have to take the pointed end of their chipping hammer, set it on the flux and drag it down the bead to remove everything. It is a one-upmanship thing in a shop to be getting yourself dialled in so that you can do this. The other thing that indicates too much heat is that there is a lot of spatter on the metal. If you see all kinds of spatter alongside your weld you have too much heat or you are holding too long an arc. On AC machines that do not have infinite control and are stepped up and down this is difficult but not impossible. Randy

"R. Zimmerman" wrote: (clip) If you have it too hot you will see lots of spatter and you will have to chip like crazy to get that baked on flux off. (clip) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Mind answering a question from a self-taught, shade-tree, buzz box welder? Is that generally true, that flux that's hard to chip is a sign of too much heat?

Reply to
R. Zimmerman
6013 has a crusty slag rather than the glassy slag of something like 6011. When you run a perfect bead you will get a slag that just sits on the top of the weld. It's fun to watch the slag start to lift off the weld behind the weld point. If you are getting porosity or slag inclusions, the slag will be mechanically bonded to the weld bead. If you have globs of metal in various places, the slag will be really tough to get off. If you run a very wide weave pattern or run it too hot, there is not enough slag to properly protect the metal, it will leave a thin slag that will be bonded to the bead.

This holds for the fill and fill/freeze electrodes, the fast freeze electrodes like 6010 and 6011 have a different compositi> "R. Zimmerman" wrote: (clip) If you have it too hot you will see lots of

Reply to
RoyJ

For an angle plate I would think you want rigidity more than strength. Since all steel is about the same stiffness, the 6013 ought to be fine.

I would keep checking the angle after each full bead and swap sides as needed to keep the warpage down. Pay attention to what Randy Z says, but I would start with them clamped with a slight gap between them. I think you will get less distorsion than if they are touching.

Dan

Reply to
dcaster

I once welded together a trailer for my garden tractor out of heavy walled

1" sq. tube. For the tongue I used two lengths of the same material butted together to form a 4' long 2" x 1" section. I ran a series of 4" beads down the length of these two pieces, alternating end to end, to control warping, and by the time I was half way through the slag was popping off just as you say. The slightest tap with the chipping hammer would cause the four inch slivers of slap to fall away. Man, was I pleased with myself! It was one of those times when everything just seemed to click. The beads themselves were nearly textbook perfect; nicely crowned, no burn-through or undercut, and looking smooth and ripply. I should've taken a picture... because my welds haven't turned out that nice once since then!

The hardest thing for a hobbyist welder such as myself to get is practice time. I have some scrap 1" x that I'm going to run beads on until I "tune up" before I tackle that angle plate. When I get to that slag-peeling-off state I'll move over to the actual workpiece.

Thanks again for the advice, all. I'll take photos and post them.

Reply to
Artemia Salina

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