Actually, my whole point was that if it doesn't run, then it doesn't run. It isn't going to run OK on the ground and then crash your airplane when you're not looking. You would have to be an idiot not to know that a batch of fuel had gone bad. Not only that, but it's impossible for the oil content to decrease over time, so don't worry about the bearings.
"Sell by date" ? Cheers, Fred McClellan The House Of Balsa Dust
Sorry Paul but the plastic jugs are completly impervious to water. Thats why milk will not leak throught them. If it will hold water it will keep humidity out. The problem with the metal cans is that rust can form alkalides which then reacts with the nitro and make it shock sensitive, still that takes a good hit as with a plane crash, so the incedent with the can blowing up must have been from static electricity. In plastic containers mixed with methanol and not in direct sunlight for any length of time the fuel should last indefinatly. The only real concern is that the castor oil can degrade, so if no solid lumps are on the bottom it should be OK.
Fred,
Generic term for "it went bad".
Russ,
I quite often fly until I deadstick. If you prepare for it and fly accordingly, there should be no problem. It is when the deadstick occurrs when you are 20 feet off the ground after takeoff and the only place to put it down isn't airplane-friendly (swamp, hard bushes, rocks, etc) is the unacceptable risk for me.
How many people have had milk in their refrigerators for 10 years to prove that point? There have been several discussions about the plastic used for fuel jugs not being impervious to various substances.
I also know of a number of synthetic oils that will degrade over time and exposure to alcohol and nitromethane. I don't know of these being used in model fuel, but you seldom get an accurate listing of whats in your fuel.
Fair enough, but I think you are splitting hairs - when one is having engine problems, having it deadstick while still climbing off the strip is not uncommon, and it's certainly not uniquely caused by old fuel.
Russ.
I never said it was. But why risk it? Fuel is cheap. Aircraft are expensive.
Well, some more fine points of logic.
(i) IS fuel cheap? Not THAT cheap. (ii) What is the risk that old fuel will affect the engine? (iii) Even if it does, what is the risk that any damage will be done to the airframe? (iv) is an airframe expensive? Mine are ceretainly not, compared with the electronics and other gubbins inside them, most of which totally survives a complete airframe disintregration.
If you want to use a cost/benefit case to justify your position, you need to do a complete survey on the cost of damage per flying minute of aircraft running on old fuel versus new, and show that it is significantly higher than the cost of replacing the old fool.
I'm sorry to say that I was a victum of the old fuel syndrome. I tryed to use some 15 year old fuel. On the ground the engines ran up just fine, like they did before. But once in the air, the plane would be haulin a_ _. Then at the worst possible moment, FLAME OUT. I lost 6 good planes that year. NOT pilot error, always a flame out. Since then I only buy a gallon or two and wait until most of it is gone before I buy more. Fresh fuel is the only way to go. Take it from me, I know from experience. Thanks, Dan.
Its teh same with old fools and 15 year old girls. Up and away and premature flameout.
Stick to fresh women, not stale old cans from who the alcholo has completely evaporated...
Oh, gosh, don't say that! You obviously don't know how to adjust an engine! ;^)
Hang on... it took you *6 planes* before you tried some new fuel? Your local hobby shop must love you.
Russ.
Any aircraft can be landed without power.
Some, like the F-104, simply can't be used again.
Having just received a case of fuel, I can relate that the current EPA HazMat shipping surcharge is five bucks a gallon. Cheers, Fred McClellan The House Of Balsa Dust
FYI, my information is that if fuel is shipped in quarts, there is no HazMat charge. Also, if it is shipped by freight truck there is no HazMat charge. Only if in containers larger than quarts and if shipped by one of the fast methods is there a HazMat charge. I thought a spill was a spill regardless of who dropped it! A screwy rule if you ask me!
Dan Thompson (AMA 32873, EAA 60974, WB4GUK, GROL) remove POST in address for email
Maybe because the quick shippers aren't as careful?
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