quick poll - american cars

Bill wrote:


I know people who've had nothing but troubles with Toyota's and will never buy another.
I've been driving American cars for thirty years and have had only a couple problems which weren't related to normal wear and tear in all that time. The problems were with electrical harness routing on a 95 Ranger, were fixed under warranty, and they never returned.
I work with a guy who swears Honda's far outlast American cars despite his high mileage vehicles being in the shop every other month for wheel bearings, cv joints, tie rod ends, ball joints, struts, slipping transmissions, leaky seals, etc. Sure doesn't sound like they outlast American cars to me.
--
Black Dragon

A chap down in Oklahoma
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I guess it's where you live and who you talk to. I've heard nothing but good things about both Honda and Toyota. Statistacally speaking I would venture to guess there are more Honda's and Toyota's still running economically after 200,000 miles than there are American vehicles. The Japanese builders listened to Deming after WWII, Detroit didn't. If it was 1970 I would rather buy a Camaro or Mustang or GTO or Cuda or Coronet or 442. But it isn't. The best vehicles are built buy companies who implement Demings principles. End of story. Full stop.
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In 1977 I bought a new plymouth Volari/Dodge Aspen, I put it that way because one side was a plymouth and the other a dodge, same ass'y line; I was young and too stupid to know better. My next car was a new 82 corolla that I put 394,000 miles on in 17 years, not one iota of trouble, I later gave it away to a young man who needed help and it still ran like a champ. I guess you really can't fix stupid, I still buy american cars.

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The problem with Honda, Toyota, Acura, etc. is that the cylinder head has so little material in it that if you experience even a momentary overheating problem such as would be caused with say a fan switch failure you're looking at a very expensive cylinder head rebuild. Other manufactures have more material in the head and their heads can often handle a brief over heating situation... not so with Honda, Toyota or Acura. This FACT makes automotive repair shops tons of money.
Do Honda, Toyota and Acura have advantages... certainly they do. They have a much better fit and finish and I believe they hold their suppliers to tighter tolerances.
I've had two Honda's. Both had cylinder head problems. I'd never buy another Honda again.
A classic Saab 900 Turbo is a much better designed and engineered car. The classic Saab 900 uses double wishbone for it's front suspension. The only major weakness of the Saab 900 Turbo is a gearbox that can't handle over 300 hp without being babied. The engine can easily be made to output 450 hp. It's a far better car in every possible way compared to a Honda... better ride, better handling, more room, better engine, etc.
Jon Banquer San Diego, CA
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Always refreshing to see that your ignorance knows no bounds. Be it CAD/CAM, machine tools, measuring equipment, business practices, or automobiles, your stupidity just oozes from every keystroke.
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I have a friend that Never, ever, changed his oil on his new camry. He was lucky because this was the model years they were sludging. Get this, 37000 MILES on original oil and then it just died, and Toyota just gave him a new motor no questions asked, free and clear, talk about dumb ass luck for someone who didnt deserve it. But he kept it washed and clean.
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#    
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Sure, but when I buy a car, it is 2 or 3 years old. I drive too much to take the hit on a new car. After a model has been out 2 or 3 years, lemon issues are fairly well identified.
Wes
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wrote:

------------- It may be informative to review the history of some of the car makers that stopped production after the new car boom that followed WW2.
Of particular interest is that these defunct companies were pioneers and introduced many innovations still in use today such as air conditioning (Nash), flow through heating ventalation (Nash Weathereye) "stepdown body design" (Hudson), and unibody construction (Nash), but were still unable to remain as viable companies. This should be a special warning to those that assume Detroit can "innovate" or "engineer" their way out of their current problems.
Note the common threads in the following histories, how closely they resemble each other, and how the Detroit big three, with the possible exception of Ford, never seemed to learn anything, as the same factors are at work in the current difficulties.
Hudson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudson_Motor_Car_Company#AMC_Hornet
Nash http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nash_Motors
Studebaker http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Studebaker
Packard http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Packard
and brand names that were dropped
De Soto http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeSoto_ (automobile)
Oldsmobile http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oldsmobile
Plymouth http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plymouth_ (automobile)
Unka' George [George McDuffee] ------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end?
Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).
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I loved the little star like washer that was there for no reason other than to retract and hold the brushes to assist in the easy reinstallation of the armature in the Chrysler reduction gear starters.
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