I did not see anywhere that Shawn said he'd expect top quality for the bare minimum. He observed that the number of quality lock manufacturers has decreased to a couple and that there is no reason to fix the less secure models because the locksmiths still sell them and service them.
I see Steve jumping to the conclusion that people only buy the cheapest that's available. That does not explain the aisle at Lowes dedicated to Baldwin and other expensive brands.
Price does not track quality, only percieved quality. The recent kryptonite lock debacle is a case in point. Expensive yet insecure.
Absolutely not. I was pointing out the fallacy of that sort of thinking. Like the fallacy of putting strong locks on my home doors given how utterly insecure the rest of the building is.
Look, the problem here is that locksmiths are complaining about this information being published. Why would you do that? Getting this information out there will make more people understand that better locks are needed. It'll probably get you some more business for that matter (all those crappy locks to replace), AND allow you to feel better about serving your customers well.
A. In most cases better locks are not needed. The locks installed are usually quite adequate for the job when all things are considered. B. 99% or more of users will never see the information to begin with.
Not really. You have to understand how price interacts with manufacturing volumes. There are limits, of course. For example, you're never going to get the production cost below the materials cost, and I'm sure that better locks will always be more expensive. The gap can be closed up some, though.
True, but keep in mind that the actual qualitative difference between a Kia and a Rolls is nowhere near as large as the price difference. The Rolls is expensive more because it's handmade and sold in very low volumes than because it's better (though, of course, it is better). If produced in large volumes, the Rolls would still cost more than the Kia, probably three to four times as much, but that's quite a bit less than the factor of 25 that separates them now.
Think about how much qualitative difference there is between, say, a $50K Mercedes and a $250K Rolls. There's actually very little difference, and by many standards the Mercedes is the superior vehicle. The rest of the price differential comes from the status associated with buying such an expensive car. The Rolls is expensive because it's exclusive, and exclusive because it's expensive. Quality really isn't the issue.
Be careful, sometimes "common sense" lets you down, because your common sense is based on everyday experience. When applying common sense to something that is well outside of your everyday experience, you're likely to be wrong.
Not that common sense should ever be ignored, just taken with a grain of salt in unusual circumstances.
Are there? I see plenty of posts that state otherwise.
And they always will be. But given enough reason to care, people would buy the $30 Chinese lockset that has a better design and better materials. Well, some would, anyway. I probably wouldn't, unless I thought they looked better or operated more smoothly.
So the high-priced stocks are the good ones? The relationship between price and quality is quite complicated. As I'm sure you're aware, price is really driven by supply vs demand. Quality is usually related in a fairly straightforward way to demand, but not always. Consider the Rolls and the Mercedes.
Baldwin is a 'good lock" security wise? ok.. expense does NOT make a good lock.. I could sell you, right now a grade 1 commercial handicapped lever, for $150 (due to current prices from my supplier), and its cheaper in a way, money wise, than some of the 'fancy sets' I have seen that are actually grade
I have been selling this lock now for 8? years and in that time had 1 have a problem with a handle (normal wear and tear situations, break in's not included) and to fix that cost the huge sum of 65 cents.
right.. Schlage makes some might fine, extremely high $ house lever sets $900 worth in fact.. but, they got the same parts in them, in some areas, and the under $50 sets
no we wont.. joe blow customer reads the bottom line $$$$ to fix your house lock will run, upwards of $750 per door. I am allowing a NEW door AND frame-not a cheap wood frame as is presently there, plus, necessary modifications TO the house itself to remove its 4 or 5 inherit weaknesses. people wont pay that, as another poster said, thats what we pay insurance for, and as LONG AS there is a damage trail, they will pay.
So the point is that many people DO buy more expensive locks without any way of knowing if those locks are actually better. There's no way to know if the new baldwin is any harder to bypass than the china import.
I believe (my opinion, of course) that it's a cop out to claim that everyone buys only based on price when the average locksmith does have high end equipment in stock to sell to the people who want it. That makes it a cop out to claim that it's OK to hide the weaknesses of existing brands under the guise of "no one would upgrade". Some of us would, some won't.
The only real valid argument against Matt Blaze that I've seen so far is that most people are glad that there are "secret" ways for locksmiths and safemen to help when they are locked out. A lock that can't be drilled nor picked in a door that's built like a vault will require serious damage to bypass, with a huge bill to match. A lock that takes a while to bypass on a sturdy door will make most people happy. It's too bad that the average Joe has no way to tell which ones would fit that need.
my girlfriend has a small dog, barks when anyone he doesn't recognize right away comes it. scared the crap out of me a few times when I wasn't expecting it. doesn't have to be a big dog really, just something that tells me "grab the 12ga by the bed". or in the case of it being in the daytime "grab the 10mm auto on your hip". true texas style home security.
Yep, I agree with your points about consumers and cost. Especially the 'that's what home and contents insurance is for' line. Still, if there are security issues with locks, the issues should be disclosed and rectified, not hidden behind 'industry secrets'. It just sounds too 'Penn and Teller' for me. Gryphonn....poetic license Steve. :o) Yep, the Reds can be unpredictable if they're not given the right attention when they're young. I'll give Jo a pat for you too. Cheers,
In respect to the cross breed, he is the same size as a Smithfield (think Mad Max/Road Warrior for the Americans) and similar coat patterning, but has more Black in him. Very compact, but he can sustain
35/40 km/h - 20 mph for about 100m/10yd uphill (that's the distance from the shed to the bore pump).
No, dogs aren't bullet - proof. The cattle dog/ border collie knows that. He still has a bullet in his gut and some scars from the other two. He was shot a while ago.
You're quite welcome to try by-passing them "Key". Most folks are either too slow on their feet or with a gun or don't have enough cartridges, or have their hands pre-occupied to bypass my dogs 'in seconds'....and food is *not* high on their list of priorities when strangers are about. They are trained that way.
People aren't willing to pay for a better lock right now.
However, if when you sell them the lock, instead of just being able to say "this lock doesn't have very good security", you could instead say "here's a printout of an article on how to defeat this lock. Every kid on your block has read this.", they might be more likely to change their tune.
When I was younger, my father once changed his back door lock when I challenged him to get in faster with the key than I could with a cheap rake pick. I won, and he changed his lock.
I find the argument that one should use an alarm instead of dogs because somebody will shoot the dogs to be hilarious. My neighbors routinely ignore burglar alarms going off, because they do so often due to user stupidity, old batteries, and crappy installation. They would be a little less likely to blow off gunshots, unless you waited until July 4th to break in.
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