$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/ap_on_bi_ge/gas_demand ;_ylt=Alg4QOCVKoG0s4WE0yyABAqb.HQA
Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?
I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view, purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.
TMT
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For sure the metal thieves will not be able to afford the gasoline to haul their collection to the scrap yard. Probably the same for the people who are advertising all the time for scrap metal.
Should be more for us!
Paul
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On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools

Less competition, so it's worth driving further? Best regards, Spehro Pefhany
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"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
snipped-for-privacy@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
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On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas. Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular. Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american gallon.
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<clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada> wrote in message wrote:

$1.21 per litre here. You do the math!
Steve R.
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On Tue, 08 Apr 2008 21:45:03 -0400, clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

==========There is the price that you pay at the pump and what gas actually costs.
Best current estimate is that *TOTAL* American gas costs to the end user/consumer are about 10 to 12$ per US gallon when subsidies, petroleum company tax breaks, tax increment financing, no cost oil from public lands, etc., (which the tax payers or their grand kids) have to make up are included.
Note that this does *NOT* include the interest cost on the borrowed money for the oil company tax breaks and evasion, military costs including American lives, tax evasion, and the geo-political costs, which adds substantial but indefinite costs to every gallon.
==> This shows again what a bad idea it is to subvert the free market by hiding costs. <If the US had been up front, with the public paying the full skippie at the pump since the mid 70s, it would not be crunch time now. Wind, solar, tidal and even bio fuels [using saw grass and agricultural waste, *NOT* food stocks] would now be major players in not only fuel but also feedstocks for plastics. We would also not have a grossly distorted economy based on subsidized transportation.
Unka' George [George McDuffee] ------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end?
Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).
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F. George McDuffee wrote:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/ap_on_bi_ge/gas_demand ;_ylt=Alg4QOCVKoG0s4WE0yyABAqb.HQA
All true and this isn't only an energy industry thing. Increased gasoline prices have already had one positive result here in LA. Traffic has dropped significantly on some routes, especially I-405 between LAX and 101. I made it from Chatsworth to Torrance (46 miles) yesterday in an hour at three o'clock in the afternoon. That is unheard of.
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John R. Carroll
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I figured it was about break point time for slovenly unnecessary driving. Lots of people flitting here and there, cell phone glued to their ear, driving a stick shift, drinking a soda and smoking at the same time. Going nowhere, doing nothing. Usually under twenty five years old.
Steve
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clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

But you have free health care ;)
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On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:51:06 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)
-- Save the whales! Trade them for valuable prizes.
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Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage ;(
Free men own guns - www(dot)geocities(dot)com/CapitolHill/5357/
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nick hull wrote:

I made up this "international icon" graphic to 'splain the situation. I thought it would make a great bumper sticker...
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/proof.htm
Richard
Now just why the HELL do I have to press 1 for English? John Wayne
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On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 08:24:23 -0500, cavelamb himself
<snip>

<snip> starting a rerun of a previous thread
One of the major problems is that the US citizens are *ALREADY* paying for universal single payer health care based on the fraction of GDP we spend. Indeed we spend about 50% more as a % of GDP than the other nations that have such care such as the UK, Canada, France, etc.
The problem is that much of this is "overhead" with no relationship to providing medical care. Indeed, we appear to be spending more money denying medical care than what it would cost to just go ahead and provide it. And then there are the multimillion dollar bonuses for the executives of the HMOs who's main function is to deny healthcare...
Unka' George [George McDuffee] ------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end?
Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).
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cavelamb himself wrote:

I wouldn't sell them. They would make a great novelty give away.
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John R. Carroll
www.machiningsolution.com
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I have a great idea, get government out of things completely. The only thing the government seems to be able to do is introduce market distortions that ultimately cost us.
I have far more faith in Exxon than Congress.
Wes
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=========While this is a great sound bite and has considerable emotional appeal to us conservatives, where it falls down is the assumption that somehow a giant corporation is not a government.
Why is socio-economic and cultural engineering any better from the Exxons of the world than from the governments of the world?
Arrange the countries by GDP, from smallest to largest and calculate the cumulative totals. Now compare this to Exxon's gross sales. http://web.worldbank.org/WBSITE/EXTERNAL/DATASTATISTICS/0,,contentMDK:20399244~menuPK:1504474~pagePK:64133150~piPK:64133175~theSitePK:239419,00.html          GDP                 Country        BC$US 2007        Cumm $US        rank (low to high) Kiribati        $0.073        $0.073        1 So Tom and Prncipe        $0.142        $0.215        2 Tonga        $0.219        $0.434        3 Dominica        $0.268        $0.702        4 Guinea-Bissau        $0.343        $1.045        5 Solomon Islands        $0.358        $1.403        6 Gambia, The        $0.379        $1.782        7 Samoa        $0.387        $2.169        8 Vanuatu        $0.421        $2.590        9 Comoros        $0.436        $3.026        10 Timor-Leste, Dem. Rep. of        $0.472        $3.498        11 St. Kitts and Nevis        $0.520        $4.018        12 St. Vincent and the Grenadines        $0.528        $4.546        13 Grenada        $0.553        $5.099        14 Liberia        $0.732        $5.831        15 Seychelles        $0.733        $6.564        16 Djibouti        $0.834        $7.398        17 St. Lucia        $0.958        $8.356        18 Guyana        $0.978        $9.334        19 Burundi        $0.989        $10.323        20 Maldives        $1.024        $11.347        21 Antigua and Barbuda        $1.079        $12.426        22 Bhutan        $1.164        $13.590        23 Belize        $1.304        $14.894        24 Cape Verde        $1.367        $16.261        25 Eritrea        $1.425        $17.686        26 Sierra Leone        $1.549        $19.235        27 Lesotho        $1.588        $20.823        28 Central African Republic        $1.647        $22.470        29 Suriname        $2.234        $24.704        30 Togo        $2.393        $27.097        31 Swaziland        $2.674        $29.771        32 Mauritania        $2.747        $32.518        33 Rwanda        $2.836        $35.354        34 Fiji        $3.289        $38.643        35 Tajikistan        $3.353        $41.996        36 Malawi        $3.441        $45.437        37 Kyrgyz Republic        $3.488        $48.925        38 Barbados        $3.739        $52.664        39 Mongolia        $3.854        $56.518        40 Lao People's Democratic Republic        $4.008        $60.526        41 Moldova        $4.021        $64.547        42 Niger        $4.219        $68.766        43 Guinea        $4.568        $73.334        44 Haiti        $5.295        $78.629        45 Benin        $5.425        $84.054        46 Nicaragua        $5.675        $89.729        47 Papua New Guinea        $5.914        $95.643        48 Chad        $6.426        $102.069        49 Malta        $6.450        $108.519        50 Bahamas, The        $6.586        $115.105        51 Namibia        $6.707        $121.812        52 Congo, Republic of        $6.848        $128.660        53 Burkina Faso        $6.858        $135.518        54 Mali        $6.936        $142.454        55 Mauritius        $7.030        $149.484        56 Madagascar        $7.306        $156.790        57 Macedonia, Former Yugoslav Republic of        $7.322        $164.112 58 Armenia        $7.802        $171.914        59 Mozambique        $8.132        $180.046        60 Cambodia        $8.488        $188.534        61 Equatorial Guinea        $9.512        $198.046        62 Georgia        $9.553        $207.599        63 Nepal        $9.627        $217.226        64 Congo, Democratic Republic of        $9.850        $227.076        65 Afghanistan, Rep. of.        $9.933        $237.009        66 Honduras        $10.059        $247.068        67 Albania        $10.310        $257.378        68 Gabon        $10.342        $267.720        69 Paraguay        $10.347        $278.067        70 Senegal        $10.701        $288.768        71 Jamaica        $10.737        $299.505        72 Zambia        $10.887        $310.392        73 Uganda        $11.141        $321.533        74 Botswana        $11.347        $332.880        75 Brunei Darussalam        $12.515        $345.395        76
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune500/2007/full_list/index.html [Exxon is #2 on the Fortune 500 @ 347,254.0 (sales), 39,500.0 (profits) [billions of US$] so their gross sales are equal to the GDP of the first 76 countries ranked by increasing GDP. Anyone care to take a guess at what percent of the world's population live in these 76 countries?
Exxon should have a seat in the United Nations, perhaps as a permanent member of the security council.
FWIW -- Walmart was #1 with 351,139.0 billion$ in sales & 11,284.0 billion in profits. The total 2007 gross sale of both these two corporations are 898,383.0 billion$ US or equal to the GDP of the first 103 countries...
Unka' George [George McDuffee] ------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end?
Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).
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On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:07:25 -0500, F. George McDuffee wrote: ...[snip various country stats from http://web.worldbank.org ]

351 trillion dollars is a pretty good sales total. More than seven times as much as the world-wide 48 trillion dollar GDP!
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It already IS a public utility in that the govt makes more profit thru taxes than the gas companies. ;(
Free men own guns - www(dot)geocities(dot)com/CapitolHill/5357/
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"cavelamb himself" wrote:

NIce try, but that is an old image. Actually saw it on a local car earlier in the week. Same color scheme, too.
Jon
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\ The problem isn't expensive gas but expensive everything - inflation at work. You need an Icon showing the Fed screwing everyone, they are the one who create inflation.
Free men own guns - www(dot)geocities(dot)com/CapitolHill/5357/
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