amerika and uk: war crimes?

if you feel that what i have contended in my posts is "unfounded blathering" perhaps you can let us know on what basis you make this sweeping statement?
after all you tell us quite clearly that you have little to do with the corporate media, and you are obviously unfamiliar with alternative sources of information...........so how exactly can you tell whether or not what i have posted is "unfounded blathering" or not?
Reply to
brain dead
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Well asshole, you continue to provide no backup to your bullshit. The way I see it, that makes for unfounded blathering. I was mistaken, you came to a gunfight, and only suck your thumb. I have no more time for a spewing piss ant such as you.
Here's a thought. I assert that you are, in fact, Jack the Ripper! I hereby accuse you of being the same! The evidence is there for anyone who is not too lazy to look! Or anyone who has not been brainwashed by the twisted history books written by the corporate-politico masters of deception! All one has to do is open one's eyes and see the truth for themselves! The crimes committed will become obvious for those not blinded by the propagandists!
Sound familiar? One thing you have done well is the choosing of your moniker. brain dead. Although, dipshit has a certain ring to it.
Willie Mays
bra> if you feel that what i have contended in my posts is "unfounded blathering"
Reply to
michael
I'm not making myself clear...I'm an engineer, PROVE that there are no WMD, you can't. I can't PROVE there are. It doesn't matter what I believe, I don't believe ANYTHING either way without PROOF. Imagine I'm back in school writing a thesis in "Strength of Materials"..."Professor, I believe that the material in question will respond this way under these circumstances. No, I don't have any work to show to back-up my beliefs, but I did find a website that says that." Guess what...I just failed the class. Don't be sucked in to anybody's version of the truth, they ALL have an adgenda. Research something FULLY and COMPLETLY and you will find that there is no black and white only various shades of grey. There are many books on the subject of doing good research, if you're realy interested in forming and discussing educated decissions, you have to follow standard procedures with ALL the evidence available. You should be reading everything you can from the people that most oppose your own views and then make clear, calm educated hypothisis. Be able to counter the opposition's best arguments with cool logic and credible refererances. Did you ever take any debate classes? Same thing...It's not wether you are right or wrong in the long run (very seldom IS there a cut-and-dried right and wrong) it's how you present your case to the judges that you either win someone's understanding or come across as not having done the work.
Whatever your beliefs are, and honestly I don't care what they are, you must present them to other people in a manner that lends credibility, intelligence, conviction and serious thought with carefully weighed facts and show that you have done your homework.
Again, you're preaching to the choir, name one person in the US that really believes this political drivel. We are not that stupid as a culture. WE KNOW!!! It's a game.
Now do you really think that the US command said to the tank commanders: "Roll in there and attack those unarmed civillians, that'll show 'em who's boss!" ...or: "Drop some cluster bombs on these peasants, for GOD'S sake man, they can't read."
Reply to
Tom Gardner
is the this perhaps the same culture in which before attacking the people of Iraq, around 60% of its members felt that Saddam was directly responsible for 9/11?
are these modern high tech weapons so indescriminant that it seems they are about as accurate as a bow and arrow, and are us soldiers not able to understand that shooting at an ambulance may well result in the deaths of civilians?
and finally after the horror surrounding acts of us aggression in se asia, is there no wish to make the slightest attempt to make sure that such a bloodbath never happens again?
Reply to
brain dead
i guess that being inarticulate and dim, does present quite a problem when it comes to taking part in a thread with people that are perhaps not quite as stupid!
Reply to
brain dead
I don't know anyone that believes that Iraq had anything to do with 9-11, I think that 60% sounds high, who did the poll? The old trick in polling is to poll the demographic sector that will give you the response that you want. (Figures lie, liers figure...everybody has an adgenda) So, I don't believe in polls, I'm not saying you're wrong, I just don't think that a true 60% ever believed that Iraq had anything to do with 9-11, just 60% of the targeted poll. I'm sorry that I am so sceptical of any "facts" that ANYBODY" presents. Yes, we have some stupid people in the US...but not all. Don't forget that you can only recieve a limmited amount of info about the US people and it is filtered.
Reply to
Tom Gardner
you seem very selective about what you believe!
it seems to me that looking at us media output before the people of Iraq were attacked, that it would be pretty unlikely that a large proportion of us population didnt believe Saddam responsble for 9/11!
the actual numbers dont matter a great deal, but its prettty obvious that without very strong public support toward attacking the people of Iraq, that congress would never have approved the plans for the attack that bush and co had made some 2 years before!
and finally it seems to me that as many of the high tech "smart" weapons systems employed by the us seem so inaccurate, that perhaps the billions of tax dollars that paid for them, have been very badly spent!
responsible
Reply to
brain dead
And I'm not at all surprised that you think it so, brain dead. You've shown an unerring ability to jump from an ambiguous fact to a speculative conclusion, even when the preponderance of evidence points the other way.
Look, for once, with open eyes at the evidence that is now all around, lately from the many transcripts of interviews that have been made public from Bob Woodward's book. This is an administration that does something like what you do: it looks, and then sees what it wants to see. You're the flip side of Dick Cheney. You've already determined the answer. Now, each time a question comes up, you know what the answer is before the question is even completed. You have a filter that removes all distractions, such as the nakedness and ambiguity of the facts.
It's something that you apparently have little regard for: The naked, often inconvenient, frequently infuriating, truth.
Ed Huntress
Reply to
Ed Huntress
like it or not Ed attacking the people of Iraq, cannot ever bring a single benefit to the likes of you and i, and the current situation in the region looks like things are now getting totally out of control.
if we merely accept that we can do nothing to stop such things as making murderous attacks on inoccent people, does that not really say we may as well give up, and admit we are not human beings, but robots at the beck and call of anyone who is able to press the right buttons?
Reply to
brain dead
I've been trying to tell you...I don't believe in anything, or at least not that I could explain. Try and imagine an onion...layers upon layers upon layers. When you find the "Essence" of one layer you will find that it is being influenced by both layers on either side. It is simplistic to think that each layer is an entity onto itself. You have to conceder the whole onion. As an experiment, expand your thinking three dimensionally. Once you grasp the idea I'm trying to present, trust me, your thoughts will be somewhat different. Reevaluate your belief system constantly, nothing is black or white. The truths that you hold dear today may be different tomorrow. What REALLY matters to you and WHY???
If you have ever gotten a bit of good advice, here's mine: Read Richard Feynman's "The Pleasure of Finding Things Out and the Meaning of It All" This book will change your life, your philosophy and the way you see the world. He's not political, he's a physicists. Do a google on "Feynman" and you will see the caliber of the man. Look on Amazon at the reviews of his books.
To use your own argument against you, you can't reference the US media for ANYTHING...they have an agenda!!!
Wrong thinking!!! Congress didn't ASK the public, they ran polls, remember what I said about polls?
Wrong again! The high-tech smart weapons hit precisely what they were aimed at...some congressional districts where they were being made. Can you say "PORK".
Reply to
Tom Gardner
definitely brain dead.
Reply to
Richard Lamb
i wonder tom whether you would agree that either of our respective goverments (us or uk), should be empowered to engage in acts of aggression anywhere they may wish, against anyone, with little regard to rule of law, or any consideration toward whether or not those that are being attacked, actually pose any sort of direct threat to them, that is not wholly a concoction of propagandists?
personally i dont think it is a good idea to afford governments the power of life and death over many thousands (and in the case of Iraq, millions) of people, on a basis which suggests to me that they are certainly little better than those responsible for 9/11!
in one of the most recent attacks the people of Afghanistan posed no threat to either the us or uk, and strangely not one of the so called terrorists (one of which was a 13 yr old boy), who were captured in attacking one of the poorest countrys on earth, have been brought to trial!
in the case of Iraq there was not even the most tenouos information to link the region to terrorism, and certainly no evidence that would ever have seriously been condsidered in a court of law, to suggest that there were any wmds.
as i contended previously these 2 most recent attacks seem to me to equate pretty much to what was done on 9/11, and indeed the criteria indicated in a us army handbook that defines an act of terror, would on the evidence available seem to validate this point.
i know for certain that bliar is a war criminal, and has lied and misled the uk people so he can support us acts of aggression..............i wonder if you feel the same about bush?
I've been trying to tell you...I don't believe in anything, or at least not that I could explain. Try and imagine an onion...layers upon layers upon layers. When you find the "Essence" of one layer you will find that it is being influenced by both layers on either side. It is simplistic to think that each layer is an entity onto itself. You have to conceder the whole onion. As an experiment, expand your thinking three dimensionally. Once you grasp the idea I'm trying to present, trust me, your thoughts will be somewhat different. Reevaluate your belief system constantly, nothing is black or white. The truths that you hold dear today may be different tomorrow. What REALLY matters to you and WHY???
If you have ever gotten a bit of good advice, here's mine: Read Richard Feynman's "The Pleasure of Finding Things Out and the Meaning of It All" This book will change your life, your philosophy and the way you see the world. He's not political, he's a physicists. Do a google on "Feynman" and you will see the caliber of the man. Look on Amazon at the reviews of his books.
To use your own argument against you, you can't reference the US media for ANYTHING...they have an agenda!!!
Wrong thinking!!! Congress didn't ASK the public, they ran polls, remember what I said about polls?
Wrong again! The high-tech smart weapons hit precisely what they were aimed at...some congressional districts where they were being made. Can you say "PORK".
Reply to
brain dead
What does that have to do with "war crimes," brain dead? I'm not arguing with you about the situation in Iraq.
Just don't lose your moorings and make unwarranted claims about international law.
Ed Huntress
Reply to
Ed Huntress
(us or uk), should be empowered to engage in acts of aggression anywhere they may wish, against anyone, with little regard to rule of law, or any consideration toward whether or not those that are being attacked, actually pose any sort of direct threat to them, that is not wholly a concoction of propagandists?
life and death over many thousands (and in the case of Iraq, millions) of people, on a basis which suggests to me that they are certainly little better than those responsible for 9/11!
either the us or uk, and strangely not one of the so called terrorists (one of which was a 13 yr old boy), who were captured in attacking one of the poorest countrys on earth, have been brought to trial!
the region to terrorism, and certainly no evidence that would ever have seriously been condsidered in a court of law, to suggest that there were any wmds.
pretty much to what was done on 9/11, and indeed the criteria indicated in a us army handbook that defines an act of terror, would on the evidence available seem to validate this point.
uk people so he can support us acts of aggression..............i wonder if you feel the same about bush?
You know, I don't normally debate with a faceless nom de plume. You've proven that you are too weak to face this group directly by changing your posting name (I know - the obvious reply is that you'd fear for your safety) and that your arguments are based on emotion rather than fact or law.
Your standard response to any challenge seems to be "I wonder..." or "I feel". Hint - no one cares how you feel unless you can back it up. There are a lot of feeling people in the sanitarium, bouncing off the walls because they don't have their tin foil beany anymore.
This is the first time you said "I know (sic)..." Prove it. No feelings, no "I think" or "I wonder". Provide hard, cold evidence that is widely accepted.
And as Tom said, I will not do your homework for you. Defend your accusations.
Reply to
Rick Chamberlain
goverments (us or uk), should be empowered to engage in acts of aggression anywhere they may wish, against anyone, with little regard to rule of law, or any consideration toward whether or not those that are being attacked, actually pose any sort of direct threat to them, that is not wholly a concoction of propagandists?
power of life and death over many thousands (and in the case of Iraq, millions) of people, on a basis which suggests to me that they are certainly little better than those responsible for 9/11!
threat to either the us or uk, and strangely not one of the so called terrorists (one of which was a 13 yr old boy), who were captured in attacking one of the poorest countrys on earth, have been brought to trial!
link the region to terrorism, and certainly no evidence that would ever have seriously been condsidered in a court of law, to suggest that there were any wmds.
equate pretty much to what was done on 9/11, and indeed the criteria indicated in a us army handbook that defines an act of terror, would on the evidence available seem to validate this point.
the uk people so he can support us acts of aggression..............i wonder if you feel the same about bush?
if you wish to defend the indefensible then that is entirely up to you!
in terms of my needing to back up what i have contended in my postings, it would seem that the facts speak for themselves!
Reply to
brain dead
perhaps any citizen of a country which is perhaps the most prolific exponent and supporter of terrorism on earth, is not well qualified to make comments relating to international law?
Reply to
brain dead
Probably not. An Iranian or a Syrian would really have to know what they're talking about, and they'd have to be very convincing. I'm sure there are many Iranians and Syrians who do, and who could.
The ones least qualified, however, are those who like to talk about it but who obviously don't understand even the rudiments of international law. That would include people from all over, who have a grudge or who are given to the use of imagination rather than study.
What brings you to your knowledge of international law, brain dead? Where did you pipe into it? Unless you're a lawyer practicing in the field, you must have some other business or personal interest.
Ed Huntress
Reply to
Ed Huntress
Amazingly predictable. Nothing to support your wild suppositions, nothing to add to the debate. Nothing but twisting in the wind.
And, the *facts* as you call them do not speak for themselves.
Truly, sir (ma'am?), you are brain dead.
Reply to
Rick Chamberlain
My one vote is meaningless but is the only thing of power that I have and I won't give it up or away or sell it...Well, maybe sell it.
Plans to invade Iraq? YA' THINK??? I'll bet we have plans to invade England, Canada, Austrailia, France, China, Germany, Japan, S.Korea, N.Korea...etc. I'l bet there are many, many planed scenerios. The Goverment probably has thousands of people and lots of resources doing nothing but plans to attack every other country. By the way, who do you think controls the people, that control the people, that control Bush? Who do you think will be next? I'm kinda' hoping for canada...lots of resources, they speak English, they don't have guns. It would be a cake-walk. And then when I go on my trips to Canada (the new 51-56th states) there won't be any delays to cross the border. That will cut an hour off my trips each way. And, NO DUTY on the beer!!! Great Beer!!!
Reply to
Tom Gardner
Like the fact you've never posted a metal content post to this metalworking group?
Troll.
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