Anniversary of an amazingly enduring design

Monday, March 29, is the 99th anniversary of the legendary 1911 semiautomatic pistol designed by John Moses Browning.

The 1911 .45 was the standard U.S. military sidearm for most of a century until the mid-80's when it was supplanted by the Beretta M9

9mm, partly because 9mm was/is a standard NATO munition, partly because the M9's were cheaper to manufacture and partly because it reduced training costs since learning to shoot a 1911 well takes longer than learning to shoot a 9mm. The M9 is an accurate pistol, quite easy to shoot well, but spec ops who can have whatever sidearm they want sometimes opt for a 1911 because a .45 hits harder.

The 1911 is a classic, still very much in demand today. There are dozens of companies currently making 1911's including majors like Springfield, Kimber, Para and Taurus and more elites like Wilson Combat etc. One can buy a new one for as little as $500, or a hand-made custom for well north of $3K and the makers of those are backlogged for over a year. Essentially same design, finely crafted.

How many designs more complex than a paper clip are still so viable a century after conception? The zipper might be one, but I think the list of other candidates is quite short.

The M2 50-caliber machine gun that JMB designed is still in active service with U.S. forces. The man was a genius designer.

Attitudes toward firearms vary and I respect that, but I submit that a designer of this rare level of accomplishment is worthy of note by readers of a metalworking newsgroup.

Reply to
Don Foreman
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There's a one hour biography show on JMB I've seen on the History or Military Channel. I would guess there would be a replay on Monday. The man was an incredible genious. How he could conceive such complex and reliable mechanisims is beyond me.

And, he didn't have AutoCAD or Alibre to do his designs

Karl

Reply to
Karl Townsend

That's a very enduring design, yes. I actually own a Beretta and love it. How does that .45 handle, is the recoil a little too much?

i
Reply to
Ignoramus11443

On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 01:21:32 -0500, the infamous Don Foreman scrawled the following:

Thanks, Don. Happy Anniversary, John; I salute you.

-- "Not always right, but never uncertain." --Heinlein -=-=-

Reply to
Larry Jaques

And at the other end of the scale, just to show his versatility, he designed the falling-block Winchester Hi-Wall single-shot.

Reply to
Ed Huntress

The recoil is completely undramatic. With service loads, it's a little slower to get back on target than a full-size nine, but it doesn't feel heavy to me. I'm been shooting them for just under 40 years and they remain my favorite target pistol.

Reply to
Ed Huntress

I prefer 9mm personally, mostly for the high capacity. I have shot friend's .45s many times during the same shooting sessions as my 9mms and really didn't notice much difference in recoil. Given my tendency for carpal tunnel issues I would think I'd notice. I do notice a difference in recoil between my two S&W 9mms, one being metal frame and one being plastic frame with about 12oz weight difference and otherwise with the same barrel length and shooting the same ammunition. The lighter plastic frame 9mm has more pronounced recoil as you would expect with the lower weight / mass.

Reply to
Pete C.

Most people don't seem to find the recoil of a 1911 to be an issue. There is recoil, but it's "mellow" rather than "sharp" like a .40S&W or 10mm and there's 40 oz of mass there to help soak it up. You would notice more recoil than with your Beretta but I don't think it'd bother you.

Reply to
Don Foreman

Then he went on the year of Mormon proselytizing. He and a companion walked into a backwoods Georgia gun store, sweaty, smelly and dusty from the road, saw a production one for the first time, got all excited and exclaimed something like "Hey, that's my design. I made that gun!".

The owner threw them both out.

After that year he didn't have much more to do with the Church.

jsw

Reply to
Jim Wilkins

Good description. "Mellow" is the right word.

Reply to
Ed Huntress

You forgot to mention that the M1911 is, still, the *only* firearm shown to pass the tests that resulted in its adoption.

While many have complained about the "looseness" of the fit of its parts, the M1911 remains the only handgun that will function in spite of mud, sand, etc., under the most extreme conditions.

In "the moment of truth" the M1911 *will* function properly.

BTW, an M1911A1 fits each of my hands perfectly...

Reply to
RAM³

OK, that's good to know. I am not really into handguns that much, though I can shoot decently. I like rifles much better, tinkering with scopes and such. My next project is making a bayonet attachment for my Finnish Mosin Nagant.

i
Reply to
Ignoramus11443

Interesting story.

Reply to
Ed Huntress

JB had a gift! I have a few of his designs and I appreciate them. I have a P08 that is truely a work of art but hasn't the practicality, durability or ease of mfg. of the 1911. The bad side is that many of my handguns, especially the P08 are now too valuable as "collector" pieces that I'm afraid to use them. The last appraisal I had on the P08 was over $4k, I wish I had one to shoot!

Reply to
Buerste

Neither did NASA when we went to the moon.

Reply to
cavelamb

On Sat, 27 Mar 2010 12:07:56 -0500, Ignoramus11443 wrote: My next project is making a bayonet attachment for my Finnish

I have four of these, two carbines (M-38 and M44) and two rifles-

91-30's. I haven't acquired a Finn capture yet, still looking. Great guns, a lot of history behind them. Mine are all Ukraine refurbs.
Reply to
Yooper

An accurized 1911 will shoot 2" groups at 50 yards. Mine would when I inherited it (it's a 1941 M70 Colt-manufactured military model, never shot before it was sold through the NRA, which my uncle had accurized around

1965). But it's gotten a little looser over the years.

I considered hunting javelina with it, but my SSM Ruger will shoot groups about half that size (the gun can, but I can't. ).

Reply to
Ed Huntress

Mine is a Finnish M39. Bayonets are nonexistent. I wanted to make a bayonet adapter that can be mounted to the rifle.

Reply to
Ignoramus11443

Unless you're planning to hunt teabaggers, Iggy, you'll need to run like hell to do any practical hunting with that bayonet. d8-)

Reply to
Ed Huntress

Anelegant firearm. I really like shooting my uncles Browning Highwall.

Wes

Reply to
Wes

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