I would appreciate the groups knowledge of this idea. The battery in my back up UPS has finally died and I wonder if I could remote an automotive battery of the same voltage instead of having the factory service the unit. It's a 1250 watt unit.
TIA Ed Angell
Is this one of those big APS 1250 units? I have one of those. It uses two sealed backup/alarm batteries inside, slightly smaller than motorcycle batteries. I'd think a couple car batteries would work, but take longer to charge and harder to maintain.
GTO(John)
If the battery that was in there was a 12V battery, you can do so. I think tho that the batteries used in UPS boxes are the deep discharge marine type batteries.
-- Bob May Losing weight is easy! If you ever want to lose weight, eat and drink less. Works every time it is tried!
Not a good plan - however, you could put in a marine/deep cycle battery. Automotive batteries and deep cycle batteries are built differently, and automotive batteries will die very soon in deep cycle service, which is what you need in a UPS.
If you put in some very heavy cables (keep them as short as possible, too) you can connect up golf cart batteries (which are also deep cycle - put 2 6 volt in series to make a 12 volt) - they won't fit in the case, but they will give you more backup time.
This has been running for the last 2 years and works great:
I would not use a automotive battery. First of all, if yours is like mine, you will need 2 12volt batteries in series. I considered 2 deep-discharge marine batteries, but I didn't want wet cells underneath my servers. It turns out that these batteries work fine. They are sealed gel-cell.
You are getting some bad advice in this thread.
The following (and other info you need to know) is from my APC UPS FAQ page at:
Can I hook up my UPS to a car battery or deep-cycle battery and turn it into a "super UPS"?
No. Among other reasons, the UPS is designed to intelligently recharge a certain size battery. Connecting a larger battery will result in an improper charging profile being applied. See the previous question about why that is bad. Auto and deep-cycle batteries, both conventional and maintenance-free, cannot be used indoors. They create noxious and potentially explosive gases which must be vented outdoors. Auto batteries are typically ruined by a few deep discharge cycles. This would especially be true of the high current demanded by UPS loads.
Careful! Those SLA batteries typically have a much lower allowed discharge rate than an SLA designed for UPS applications.
You can get the same batteries that are in your UPS from most good electronic supply houses. Generally they are gel cells, and are very common. The charging characteristics of gel cells are often different than those of automotive batteries. That being said..Ive seen it done.
Gunner
"As physicists now know, there is some nonzero probability that any object will, through quantum effects, tunnel from the workbench in your shop to Floyds Knobs, Indiana (unless your shop is already in Indiana, in which case the object will tunnel to Trotters, North Dakota). The smaller mass of the object, the higher the probability. Therefore, disassembled parts, particularly small ones, of machines disappear much faster than assembled machines." Greg Dermer: rec.crafts.metalworking
Hey Richard,
Oh that more FAQ's were as good and forthcoming as yours. An enjoyable informative read. Bravo.
Thank you.
Brian Laws>Ed Angell writes:
I've done it. I have a very large UPS which requires 96 VDC. The original batteries died after several years, and I replaced them with 8 series connected automotive batteries. These were the cheapest batteries I could find ($19.95 each). The UPS ran on those batteries for a couple of years. Eventually they failed. Auto starting batteries aren't built for this sort of service. I'm running on a bank of Edison cells now. Those came to me telco surplus. They were 20 years old when I got them, and they'll probably last another 20 years.
Gary
SNIP
Edison Cell?? Wuzzat? And why will they last 40 plus years? Sounds like something from a high school, chem or physics lab. I know the big lead-acid batteries in telephone central exchanges last for many years, but 40 plus ?!?!
Inquiring mind wants to know.
Take care.
Brian Lawson, Bothwell, Ontario.
Edison cells use a nickel oxide electrode and an iron electrode in a potassium hydroxide electrolyte. They are very long lived. The ones I got are large individual cells, each about 2 feet tall, housed in glass cases. Each cell is only 1.2 volts, so I needed 80 of them in series to supply the 96 VDC my UPS requires. I have them mounted on wooden racks in the garage.
Edison cells are practically unkillable. They'll withstand prolonged overcharge, discharge, or being left uncharged. The downside compared to lead-acid is that they can't discharge very fast, so you need large cells if you need large currents. That's not a problem if you get them free as I did, and if you have the space to devote to them, which I also do.
Gary
Something is wrong with them if you only get 40 years! Edison cells are nickel-iron and are even more durable than Ni-Cd but Jungner's (sp?) original Ni-Cd battery from 18?? was discovered in an attic in Sweden in the 50's or '60s. The glass tubes were cracked and the electrolyte all dried up. The museum carefully removed the bits of glass and washed the plates. Fitted new glassware, added fresh electrolyte and charged them. Worked fine.
I have a set of 60Ah vented cell, sintered plate Ni-Cds. after several years, the electrolyte degrades - absorbs CO2 from the air and the KOH goes to carbonate. Dump the electrolyte, replace with fresh 30% KOH and I'm back in business. These are the ones that will put out 500A for
5min at -40degrees.Ted
They're also pretty robust as well, in one edison biography the describe him giving an interview with a journalist - and while it is going on there's a huge crash outside. Moments later an assistant shows up at the door, and says "one, Mr. Edison."
A while later there's a bigger crash outside, and the same guy shows up, "two, Mr. Edison..."
They were testing the cells by throwing them out the window onto the ground below. First floor, second floor...
Jim
================================================== please reply to: JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com ==================================================
Hey again Gary,
OK. Thanks. I had never heard of them. Do they give off any noxious gases like lead-acid does when charging?
Take care.
Brian Laws>>>Hey Gary,
Just a bit of hydrogen. I vent them outside (each cell has a vent hose connector).
Gary
You could use an automotive battery or even several of them in parallel to provide the same draw (or more) as the UPS did. The "brains" of the ups is on the PCB in the top of the case and I have seen those taken out of the case or the leads extended to a bank of batteries do that.
But the UPS is intended to maintain and charge a specific type of sealed battery and it might not be appropriate for different types of batteries or even a larger number of batteries of the right type.
As far as "servicing" the unit. I "serviced" my APC 1400 watt UPS by simply opening the case, identifying the batteries, and buying two replacements. It cost me about $100 to get a good as new UPS with a retail value of about $600.
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