MIG at home garage legality

wrote:


As many have noted, the weld puddle metal will be well above the Curie point, and so will not be magnetic. Loss of magnetism is a classic way to tell that a piece of steel is hot enough to be quenched during hardening.
Joe Gwinn
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Bill McKee wrote:

Can you weld upside down with a given process?
--
Paul Hovnanian snipped-for-privacy@hovnanian.com
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True you can weld upside down. But you may have faster cooling from the convection and maybe more surface pressure. If any gas generated in the welding, it would have a tendency to blow the metal all directions.
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Wes wrote:

Wear your space suit and go outside and get some perfect non contaminated welds... Just don't burn a hole in your suit. :)
John
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Ignoramus21954 wrote:

If you can weld upside-down (overhead) you can weld in weightlessness.
Bill K7NOM
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ignoramus21954@NOSPAM.21954.invalid says...

Don't

up

fire

Good question, Iggy! I was the Facility Manager for NASA's Zero Gravity Research Facility during the 1990s. We supported the Combustion Science and Fluid Physics branches. I don't believe I ever heard any mention of a welding experiemnt, I think you could get a grant or two out of that idea!
There were some molten alloy experiments (not at our facility, they took too long), but they were concerned with the solidification process, which can produce dentrites (metal hairs within the pool). In general alloys mix better because the heavier elements do not sink and they were seeking super alloys because of the better distribution.
Welding in low Gs would certainly be different. There would of course be the tendency for the pool to float away, but the cooling metal would be driven by various forces like the arc blow, surface tension, etc instead of gravity. It would cool slower because of the lack of convection.
--
DT



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On Fri, 09 Apr 2010 15:59:15 -0500, the infamous Ignoramus21954

Not recommended. (Arc Welding 101 was taught on Apollo 1)
RIP, guys.
-- Climb the mountains and get their good tidings. Nature's peace will flow into you as sunshine flows into trees. The winds will blow their own freshness into you, and the storms their energy, while cares will drop away from you like the leaves of Autumn. -- John Muir
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It all depends on your neighborhood. If you are close to neighbors, they might object to the sparks and noise and smoke. Basically, you can do anything you can get away with. But once a call has been made to zoning or the FD, it's on file, and after that, you're subject to fines.
As for asking permission, it is a bad idea, and I am sure they would tell you no. Some standard issues are: you cannot keep "stock in trade" at your home; you cannot increase the traffic to the neighborhood; you need to be cleared by the FD (which will be impossible); you need to be licensed, and what you want to do is considered manufacturing, and a residential zone cannot be a manufacturing zone.
"claiming some sort of residential fire hazard?" Melting metal past its melting point is definitely a fire hazard, and dangerous even in a properly equipped shop.
Unless you live in a rural area, or have a shop removed from the house, or just have good neighbors, it doesn't sound like your idea is plausible. The first time someone makes a phone call, it's all over. And SHOULD you have some accidental fire and FD comes out and finds the cause, you can be fined pretty severely.
Steve
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Never ask for permission, they might get the idea that they have the power to grant or deny it.
"It's easier to ask forgiveness than it is to get permission" is often attributed to Grace Hopper. The lady and officer had a clue.
Wes -- "Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller
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On Fri, 09 Apr 2010 19:22:49 -0400, the infamous "Steve B"

With the city, probably. What about the insurance agent who covers the fire? ("I was welding a project" would probably fly, getting your damage paid for. "I was welding a product I sell" would probably get you in trouble.)
-- Climb the mountains and get their good tidings. Nature's peace will flow into you as sunshine flows into trees. The winds will blow their own freshness into you, and the storms their energy, while cares will drop away from you like the leaves of Autumn. -- John Muir
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If you are running a business out of your garage, without the correct insurance, the learning experience will be expen$ive.
Wes
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scrawled the following:

Two words I hate: should and probably. I think that the claim would be denied either way.
Steve
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I have never had a problem. I do try not to make a lot of noise before about 8 am and stopped about 8 pm. With MIG you should have almost no smoke or sparks and very little noise, but bashing the stainless into shape before welding could be a problem.
It isn't as if you are going to be making a lot more noise than a lawn mower or leaf blower.
Dan
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wrote:

I have never had a problem. I do try not to make a lot of noise before about 8 am and stopped about 8 pm. With MIG you should have almost no smoke or sparks and very little noise, but bashing the stainless into shape before welding could be a problem.
It isn't as if you are going to be making a lot more noise than a lawn mower or leaf blower.
Dan
I lived in a neighborhood and did ornamental metal out of my garage before I went into business. No one complained, and it was a "tight" neighborhood, meaning the houses were close together.
So, you may do it, and have no problems. The issue starts when ANYONE calls zoning and starts any paperwork. Or, God forbid, you have a fire.
Thinking back on it now, I had some great neighbors because you know how much racket a chop saw makes, and I was doing a lot of work.
Keep it reasonable, keep it out of sight as much as possible, and hope for the best. And don't weld at night. It's a dead give-away.
Almost no smoke or sparks from MIG and very little noise?
Steve
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Thanks. Really good info. Just a follow up question..... My garage is not attached to my house and is built into a rock hill with the front door being the only opening. Thus, the only ventilation I have is the front door. If I keep it closed while doing welds, will the gasses cause problems? Plan is to do a few quick welds and open the door to air out.
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wrote:

Thanks. Really good info. Just a follow up question..... My garage is not attached to my house and is built into a rock hill with the front door being the only opening. Thus, the only ventilation I have is the front door. If I keep it closed while doing welds, will the gasses cause problems? Plan is to do a few quick welds and open the door to air out.
You want ventilation while welding. Get a fan. A bathroom fan would work and run some flexible duct from the fan mounted in an exterior wall to the weld area. Then suck the fumes as you weld. Commercially is very similar to what is done. But good fans to exchange air in building.
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wrote:

Thanks. Really good info. Just a follow up question..... My garage is not attached to my house and is built into a rock hill with the front door being the only opening. Thus, the only ventilation I have is the front door. If I keep it closed while doing welds, will the gasses cause problems? Plan is to do a few quick welds and open the door to air out.
reply: Just remember that all that smoke goes somewhere, and some of it ends up in your lungs. I would make an exhaust fan somewhere, and run it while welding just to keep any smoke at a continuous low unnoticeable level. If you stick, you will have more smoke. Don't have a strong draft on the MIG welding area. Even those whirlybird exhausts work pretty good for sucking out the smoke.
Steve
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What's that Lassie? You say that Steve B fell down the old rec.crafts.metalworking mine and will die if we don't mount a rescue by Fri, 9 Apr 2010 16:12:17 -0700:

Right. The major problem is the selling. If you were just making things for yourself, doing home repairs, etc. you would be OK. If you had a steel beam in your garage that needed welding and you called in someone to fix it, you would be OK. Big welding truck, engine driven welder, sparks all over.
If you were sewing dolls for a craft fair, you would be OK.
But welding is thought of as an industrial process so you might run into problems.
Don't ask, don't tell. Keep quiet, cover the windows, fireproof as much as you can.
--

Dan H.
northshore MA.
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One tip, don't tell your neighbors what you are doing. You never know when one knows he missed his chance to be part of the Schutzstaffel and you are his chance to revel in the perceived glory of being a defender of the 'nothing is allowed unless it is approved thinking' we are sliding into by complaining to the authorities (bureaucrats).
After running your MIG, don't just head into the house. Take some time to say in the garage to make sure you didn't start the makings of a fire.
When I had a welder, I did it outside of the garage with the doors shut. Too darn many things inside the garage to catch fire or smolder.
You sound like a candidate for living outside the town. Life is a bit less regulatory out there.
Oh, post links to pictures of your sculpture when you finish one. We like seeing metalworking when we are not arguing about other things.
Wes
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My insurance specifies no welding within 25 feet of the buildings.
--
Michael Koblic,
Campbell River, BC
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