Ultimate Workshop?

make sure you overdo the electric power to he building... you are always gonna need more power over the years when some new tool comes home if you dont have it now, plan for it in the future.. wire is cheap?? now, so they say, well wait 20 yrs from now and you will be saying i could have that darn thing wired for x number of dollars way back when, but i put it off and figured it could get it done when needed, and it now cost XXXX dollars to do it...

If you're in a climate that needs heat in the winter I would suggest a radiant floor heat. There is nothing worse than having a floor that is cold while working on a vehicle. I know. I have radiant floor heating in the house but not in the garage. I can warm the garage with a heater but the floor is still cold. All you would need would be a water heater and circulating pump. And like "jim" said lot's of power. I'd go for a 200 amp service. Hopefully I'll be able to build my shop in the next couple of years. Right now the basement is being used as a shop. Check out my web site.

Regards, Bernd

I was at least wise enough to figure that one out on the old shop. I installed a 200 amp service on it, with conduit circuit runs, and I have never regretted it. I've now got a welder alone that calls for a 95 amp circuit. I'm beginning to think related to electrical service that "Some is good, more is better, and too much is just enough"

RJ

Very true. I just finished building a carport onto the rear of my house, and during the concrete pour, an empty conduit was added to be able to run hard line phone, cable, intercom, and network cable through the pad to later run to the future shop. That got me 32 feet without digging. I may also look at a subpanel or two in the shop, instead of doing home runs on everything. I have an old 5 hp, 3 ph motor that takes two men to pick up, to replace the modern lighter one on my still un-used homebrew phase converter. Any thoughts on this and the subpanels?

RJ

I've been researching that subject, and it sounds mighty sweet. My only issue is that I have a nice Hilti anchor drill, and I ain't afraid to use it! Luckily, my compressors were bolted down during the flood. Still considering it though. How expensive is the radiant heat to operate in fuel costs? Thinking about a gas pack for quick heat, with radiant for more extended work periods. Thanks.

RJ

Bernd, thanks for the shop tour. That looks like a nice, comfortable place for your type of hobby, for sure. I considered downsizing mine. Instead, I think I'll build larger this time.

RJ

Bernd, what type of water heating unit is that in your basement corner?

RJ

If you want to be really "ultimate" what about a geothermal heatpump? For a shop-sized building, it'd probably be just pennies to run per month.

Backlash wrote:

Ultimate, but economically feasable might be a better way to describe things A well here has to go to an aquifer about 160 feet down, from what I'm told, and the well drilling expense alone for my present one that originally fed the mobile home behind me was around $600 or so twelve years ago. I already have a 4 month old 3 1/2 ton standard package type heat pump I got in a trade that is a consideration. Good suggestions. Keep 'em coming.

RJ

There are a number of advantages to radiant floors. Cold floors can also be a source of condensation. I have had mine covered in water in the past. Installing underfloor heating forces you to insulate the floor. You don't loose any wall space for radiators or blowers etc. Downside is that it takes a long time to warm up.

John

Is anyone on the NG using solar collectors in addition to a radiant heat system? My roof will be oriented so that the sun will be on one side of the roof slope for a lot of the day. The thought crossed my mind that this method might conserve energy, dependent on cost, or serve somewhat as a "preheat" for the system. I once read Mother Earth News, and in it there was a shop water heater made out of an old refrigerator mounted on the south shop wall in a horizontal position so that the door could be opened to the proper angle, with coils in it, to act as a solar collector. A water tank behind plastic glazing was in the box. The door was shut during the night hours to conserve absorbed heat for the next day.

RJ

I guess that would make sense, because once you get down so far below the frost line, isn't the temp around 55 degrees? That way, you would only have to boost it 15 degrees for a nice temp. There once was an air intake system known as earth tubes that used convoluted plastic pipe through the ground as an air intake/loop for a furnace to do something similar, but people complained that it smelled "earthy".

RJ

"> it! Luckily, my compressors were bolted down during the flood. Still

Depending on your heat loads, etc I would look at insulated concrete forms. Effective R rating of around 45.

I went with the radiant heat on that as well. Just a large electric water heater for a heat source. The advantage of electric is not having to vent(in or out), which is a savings for heat loss. I went with off peak electricity at a rate $0.03/kwh. It's running me about $100/mo right now and it is REALLY cold outside. Been near zero or less for the last week or two. I keep my shop set at 45, which seems like it would be cold, but if I start doing anything at all I start peeling off layers as I am too warm. That's the really nice thing about radiant heat, since your feet stay warm and everything in the building is warm it feels warmer than similar forced air temperatures.

The systems they use now a) use water (or water+glycol) cirulation and b) are closed so no earthy smell (not that I speak from firsthand experience). It also provides cooling in the summer, some of which heat can be dumped to your water heater for free hot water. That doesn't apply to a shop, I'm just saying.

I looked > I guess that would make sense, because once you get down so far below the

Jeridiah, could you explain more about the insulated concrete forms? pics, website, maybe? Being in the south, that's not an item we would normally use around here. I've seen the ones used to pour basements and such, then left in place. I would assume they are integral to the flow of the building so they don't protrude from the slab, etc? What would protect them from string trimmers, lawn mowers, and such?

RJ

On Mon, 26 Jan 2004 10:03:43 -0800, Backlash wrote (in message ):

Sounds more like a playroom than a shop . A hoist monorail is good, a bridge crane is better. On electrical; don't put in duplex recepticals, instead use four-squares (Or pairs of duplexes) and split them (i.e. top on one breaker, bottom on different breaker). Also I put all outlets at 52" above the floor. This gives greater flexibility on tool placement as the cord comes out of most floor tools at that height. Also saves a lot of bending over.

I'm sure you already know this, but good lighting is essential. No workbenches against the walls. Wallspace should be filled with drawers and benches against walls collect "Stuff" to the point you don't have any workspace. Fire extinguishers and fire exits. Battery powered emergency lights (I found out the hard way on this one).

Just some random thoughts.

Roger in Vegas Worlds Greatest Impulse Buyer

|I've been researching that subject, and it sounds mighty sweet. My only |issue is that I have a nice Hilti anchor drill, and I ain't afraid to use |it! Luckily, my compressors were bolted down during the flood. Still |considering it though. How expensive is the radiant heat to operate in fuel |costs? Thinking about a gas pack for quick heat, with radiant for more |extended work periods. Thanks.

SOLAR if your climate makes it feasible! With a small water heater for backup.

|> If you're in a climate that needs heat in the winter I would suggest a |> radiant floor heat. There is nothing worse than having a floor that is |> cold while working on a vehicle. I know. I have radiant floor heating |> in the house but not in the garage. I can warm the garage with a |> heater but the floor is still cold. All you would need would be a |> water heater and circulating pump. And like "jim" said lot's of power. |> I'd go for a 200 amp service. |> Hopefully I'll be able to build my shop in the next couple of years. |> Right now the basement is being used as a shop. Check out my web site. |>

|>

|> Regards, |> Bernd |>

|>

| |

Rex in Fort Worth