Setting up a workshop on a budget

Hello, I am currently setting up my shed as a small workshop and so far I have a lathe (1948 Myford M-Type), pillar drill, small bench
grinder and some hand tools.
My main interest is in Stirling and Hot air engines and I have a Stirling kit (from www.greenweld.co.uk) that I plan on making first. Most of the machining is already completed leaving mainly drilling etc.
I need to buy some more tools and have been looking around to figure out where to get them. The http://www.chronos.ltd.uk/ website looks promising. Would anyone recommend anywhere else?
I am looking to get something like: a set of metric taps and dies a set of HSS drills (1mm to 10mm in 0.1mm increments) a vernier caliper (probably digital) a vernier height gauge (probably not digital because of cost) a 4" or 5" machine vice for my drill press a thread gauge a set of needle files a tub of barrier hand cream
There are probably other things that I have not thought of...
Any comments/suggestions appreciated.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

watch it here .........lot out there that are made of monkey metal...

j&lindustrial...hertel ones are good

Woolworth's . 7.99.......they have very good ones ...the steel is so hard that they are made out of, they have to be drilled with a carbide drill.

ebay...or http://www.pj-tooling.co.uk/payment.asp
do the callipers and the height gauges cheap .

j&industrial ...watch for the offers of a percentage off .....currently have 25% off if you spend more than 100 with them ......one postage ..think 6.99 for all items bought.

ebay
see above

Cromwell/screw-fix ...

milling machine .....

all the best.mark
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Thank you Mark, that gives me a few more places to check out. I'm surprised woolworths have digital verniers - I'll have to get to one to check them out - that price sounds great.
I would love a milling machine actually - I have been looking at the Warco machines but at the moment I do not have space for it so it will have to stay on the want list...
All the best Martin
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 05:42:46 -0700, eskimobob
Dealing with condensation... You will probably have to put in some insulation and some heating if you want to avoid surface rust on your lathe and tools. If you can keep the ambient temperature of the workshop above the dew point with something like an electric convector heater (dry heat) then you will probably be OK.
Jim.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 11 Jul, 18:03, Jim Guthrie wrote:

The Range had 1200w Infra red heaters for 15 the week before last. Got one for the patio and one for the workshop!
Stu G
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Your shed will still be a shed with all the tools & machines in it. The planning department like you to call it a workshop then they can come and have a look and say if it is a workshop you need planning permission and then you will have to pay business rates. Fill it with what you like but still call it a SHED. Vernier caliper at Netto this week 7.99. For a height gauge chop a caliper to bits and make one with that it will give you a 6" one sorry 150mm one.

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Jul 11, 6:03 pm, Jim Guthrie wrote:

Hmmm - I had not considered that at all. Presumably it would be a good idea to spray some WD40 or similar on the surfaces too?

Oh, It will definitely still be a shed. Great idea with the vernier height gauge, I may indeed give that a try.
Thanks again for your comments Martin
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 18:38:29 -0000, eskimobob
Martin,

WD40 is not really recommended for rust protection. Your best bet is probably to get some way oil since that lubricates and sticks to the surfaces.
I have a small, insulated workshop in the back of my garage - about 8ft x 8ft - and I keep it at about 50F with a 1.5kW convector heater on a low thermostat setting. When I want to work in the place in the colder months, I up the thermostat and it's up to 65 - 70F in ten minutes or so. I've had no problems with surface rust on the lathe and the mill, and the only marking on my tools is from my handling. Also, the large chunks of metal - like the lathe, vice, mill, etc., get up to the 50F ambient temperature so that you don't get the discomfort of working with a freezing cold machinery in winter time.
Jim.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Jim wrote:

I understand woodworkers use wax polish to protect cast iron and steel. Is there any reason why this shouldn't be a good idea for metalworking kit ?
-adrian
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 21:11:41 +0100, Adrian Godwin
Adrian,

I'm not sure if that would work as well with metal working kit where you should have 'proper' lubrication on the sliding areas like lathe beds, etc. Way oil is designed to lubricate and protect machined surfaces and should give more than adequate protection in the short to medium term.
Jim.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
Jim wrote:

I'm sure you're right for things like slideways, but I was thinking of places not normally lubricated like pillar drill tables, vice jaws and the non-working surfaces of gauges etc. Wax would last much longer than oil there, and would be less likely to accumulate dust.
-adrian
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 05:42:46 -0700, eskimobob

Double your budget<VBG>
Peter
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Hello Martin, always nice to see another starting out on this journey of delight to set up a workshop. I hope you realize that really it is a never ending quest and we are always looking to expand, improve or update it. Still it is an enjoyable, if at times expensive pastime whatever you use it for.
As well as Chronos there are a number of well established suppliers that are worth looking at or visiting depending on where in the country you are. The others have already mentioned a couple but also have a look at:
http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk /
http://www.rdgtools.co.uk /
http://www.axminster.co.uk /
http://www.pj-tooling.co.uk/payment.asp
And if you are interested in secondhand tooling try:
http://www.thetoolbox.org.uk /
http://www.pennyfarthingtools.co.uk /
And of course:
http://www.warco.co.uk /
http://www.chesteruk.net /
http://www.engineerstoolroom.co.uk /
For the sort of tools you mention I would have a look at ArcEuroTrade, RDG, PJ-Tooling and Chronos. There are many more but these will give you a start. Also if you can get hold of a current copy of Model Engineers Workshop or Model Engineer as their advertisements will include a lot of smaller suppliers for the various specialist items you will need. I would advise that you treat the major DIY outlets with a little care unless you are happy that you can tell good tooling from the other sort, not to say they don't provide many good bargains, they do but you need to be able to filter out some of their "special buys" etc
Looking at your list the first couple of items will need some care, there are many cheap (crap) sets about that will turn out to be expensive when you have to buy a second time. There are also so many thread types that it is easy to spend a lot of money and get taps and dies that are never used. I would suggest getting a small basic set that will cover your immediate needs and add to it as you identify a real need. ArcEuro do reasonable metric sets and a good range of individual taps and dies in the other thread types, Chronos have a wide range as well and another place to look for would be Tracy tools who specialize in cutting tools and taps and dies. You will find two different levels of pricing for taps and dies with the cheaper end being Carbon Steel and the higher end HSS. For most of us in the home workshop Carbon Steel is fine. I have nothing to do with any of these suppliers except I have bought from all of them with success although my first look these days is on the ArcEuro site as their quality/price/ service has impressed me.
Exactly the same issue arises with drills and I would recommend buying from a recognized source with a reputation to protect, I personally use Dormer, Presto or Guhring if I can and they do last well but are expensive in sets. I have had problems with a cheap un-named 6-10mm (0.1mm) set where the drills were very poorly ground and some even bent. I suggest a basic set and then compliment with specials (imperial, letter or number) if you ever need them. If the metric (0.1mm) set is cutting accurately you won't really need a lot more but with drills they are notorious for not cutting the stated size especially at steps of 0.1mm.
Files are another area where buying cheap costs money, my personal preference here is for Vallorbe which are available from Axminster at reasonable cost, J&L also do them but last time I checked they were more expensive.
Don't be frightened of buying good quality secondhand items particularly measuring equipment, with the introduction of reasonably priced imports the value of quality secondhand has dropped. I fully agree that a usable height gauge can be made from a cheap digital caliper but if you do not want digital there are many secondhand items to be found cheaply if you look. I recently bought a little used set of micrometers covering 0-5" all by Starret or Mitutoyo for 20. If you can get to one of the many shows around the country the range of items on offer is staggering even if they are not all cheap bargains.
I suppose my main advice would be not to rush into buying a lot of pretty boxes but rather take your time and pick what you need at a quality level that will last. Unfortunately, I agree with Peters (VBG) comment and I can't remember how often I've had to double my budget since I started the "quest" for a reasonably equipped workshop 25 years ago. Don't forget the search function on this forum you will find hours of interesting reading and experiences about almost everything you can think of.
Regards
Keith
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Jul 11, 10:08 pm, jontom snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com wrote:

Thank you Jon for those many links - The Arc Euro Trade site looks very good indeed. They have some nice looking stirling kits too so perhaps one of those will have to be added to my list of projects <g>
I will have to get to a show this year. I am in the Peak District near Buxton and had been planning on going to the Harrogate show earlier this year but had to call off. I have joined the Buxton Model Engineering Society and been along to a few meetings.
I've been wanting to do this for many many years so it's exciting to finally be doing something about it.
Thanks again to everyone for the comments
Regards Martin
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 05:42:46 -0700, eskimobob

<snip snip>
Martin, another good place to look for workshop stuff are the industrial auctions. Not so much for cutting tools, as these are almost always well used, but for larger items like vices and measuring tools, and even machines.
Don't be put off by the fact that you have to register, you don't always have to be a business to buy on these.
Have a look here and watch how much things go for:
http://www.goindustry.com/en/auctioncalendar.asp
www.bidspotter.com
Still think you need to double your budget though <G>, you can *never* have enough toys.
Peter
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
For your taps and dies you'll have to work hard to beat Tracy Tools in Devon: http://www.tracytools.com / they also do a fair few cutters and lathe tooling and some hand tools.
Richard
On Wed, 11 Jul 2007 05:42:46 -0700, eskimobob

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Hi there
May I comment on the condensation issue. Corrosion comes from two sources - condensation and acid from your hands. In a garage workshop or garden shed it is assumed that you have as much insulation as you can get hold of - cut up telly packing if neccessary - with a DPC (a sheet of polythene) on the warm side. That will help but is not the whole answer. Nor, in my opinion, is heating unless you can afford the fuel bill.
I have managed very well in this situation by wiping down all bright metal tools with a very light covering of gun oil. This is designed to protect against rust and is available from any gun dealer - or more straightforwardly from the internet - Parker Hale Gun Oil is what you are looking for - A couple of quid. This also solves the acid problem
As to the lathe I use a straight cutting oil in a squeezy bottle and use a wet paint brush all over the lathe when I finish playing. Then cover the lathe with sheet of soft poly.
I have had a S& for 30 years which has not trace of rust
Dont forget to oil bar stock and steel sheet. I reccommend Rocol X30 spray which you can get from Cromwell.
Hope that helps
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Polytechforum.com is a website by engineers for engineers. It is not affiliated with any of manufacturers or vendors discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.