SW suitable for large machines?

So you think mates affect the opening speed differently for multi config vs. single files?

Jas> In Scott's case, most of the single file, multi config parts were mated

Matt,

This is some very good information. I don't deal with assemblies near to the scale of what this thread is discussing. But this info will still go in the "keep" folder.

I do have one question though.

">- Don't open files by double clicking in Windows Explorer - use the Open dialog"

I am curious. What is the reasoning behind this? I almost always use Windows Explorer to open all of my files. I have never noticed any differences in speed.

The only problem I have ever run into using this method is when I open multiple files simultaneously. If for example I wanted to open 10 SW files, I used to highlight all 10 of them, right click, and select open. At some point (I think when SW2004 came out), when I tried this method it would not work. It would only open the first file. After that, no other file would open regardless of what method you used, until you closed SW. Then, by itself, SW would automatically re-open and load the second file, only. Until you closed it again and it would re-open loading the third file, and so on.

The workaround that I found was to highlight all of the files from Windows Explorer, and drag them to the SW window. I would drag them specifically to the SW window title bar. I have never had any problems with this method.

The problem is that it creates temp files in the location of the files, particularly not good if it's a network folder. At at least one customer site where there were problems with crashing, we were able to demonstrate that 100% of the "random" crashes created while I was there were attributed to opening files by double click in Windows Explorer.

Ok, now I'm confused. At first I presumed you were talking about the ~ files, and I thought maybe what I thought about them wasn't true. So I tried a test, and the ~ files showed up in the SW model folder regardless of the method used to open the SW file, so that couldn't be it. So I then looked for other temp files, and found none.

So, the only thing I can think of that you may be referring to is that prior to SW2005, the journal file used to be put wherever the model was if you opened with Windows Explorer, but if you opened through SW, it would put it in the prescribed location. Or am I missing something else here? What temp files are there besides the ~ files or the backup files?

WT

I'm pretty sure that particular "best practice" was developed in 2004, and became part of the canon. Old habits die hard. Still, I'm not sure that the fact that you can't think of a reason to follow it necessarily means you shouldn't follow it. I'm personally a bit superstitious about things like that, knowing that the only thing I know for sure is that I surely don't know everything that's going on.

There are a lot of other reasons to use the open dialog instead of Windows Explorer, such as the preview, availability of the Description info, config access, references access for assemblies, etc. Of course there are reasons not to use open such as its insistance on using List view instead of whatever you used last time you used the Open dialog (thumbnails, details), or remember the window size.

Try the test with a part on a floppy disk and see how much time it spends accessing the disk.

Matt

Is this what is being referred to as a possible cause?

Excerpt from TriMech Tips (from their website)

Are your files on a network server? Running open files across a network can be slow. Do this test: put a SolidWorks part on a floppy disk. Open the part through Windows Explorer without SolidWorks already open. As you edit the part, SolidWorks keeps writing to the floppy because it put the *.swj (SolidWorks journal) file there. If you open SW first and browse to it, this does not happen because the journal file is in your "start in" dir.

Excerpt from Matt Lombard "System Crashes Probable Cause (solidworks)"

Are your files on a network server? Running open files across a network can be slow. Do this test: put a SolidWorks part on a floppy disk. Open the part through Windows Explorer without SolidWorks already open. As you edit the part, SolidWorks keeps writing to the floppy because it put the *.swj (SolidWorks journal) file there. If you open SW first and browse to it, this does not happen because the journal file is in your "start in" dir.

Kman

Matt,

I personally don't see a difference. I have been opening files from Windows Explorer for years. My files are on a network server. I can't tell a difference in speed or reliability if I use the open dialog or W.E. I can't even tell a difference if the files are local or not [ ok, unless its on a floppy :) ]. It has just never been an issue except for the problem that I previously described, which I have a simple workaround for.

I understand the advantages that you describe for using the open dialog. And I do use the open dialog when I need to use one of these features (i.e. reference access). I just simply find it easier to understand my file structure by looking at the 'ol Explorer window. Another advantage of opening from Explorer that you didn't mention is that you can open multiple documents at one time, which I do often.

As I mentioned, that was my suspicion and the fact that Matt couldn't come up with any other real example for SW2005 tells me that we have probably properly recognized the issue. The change in the journal file location was made in SW2005, and was certainly a valid factor before then, and as Matt said, old habits die hard - especially when you don't see a compelling reason to change from the current practices.

WT

I thought 2003 started the journal file control.

Well, now you had me questioning my memory, which admittedly isn't what it used to be, so I went back to my writup from SWW2005. Item 11 from the CAD Manager's Boot Camp:

SW2005 has fixed the issue of SW putting its journal file wherever you first double-click. It now always puts it at the location specified in the file locations setting, regardless of how you start SW.

So, if I wrote it, it must be true???? :-)

WT

Oh, gee, and I was thinking that just because I told 2003 to put the journal file somewhere that it would always go there.

Ahhh, the heartbreak of the truth. Sorry, bud. :-)

WT

Activault is a PDM which adds overhead to files coming out the server. But, a client has 2000 parts, 400 files in a 1.2 GB assy and it takes 5 mins. to pull through the net.

Yeah, that's a tragic likeness. I wrote a white paper on troubleshooting crash prone systems back in 2001 or 2002 and it wound up on the Trimech site, the SW site, a couple eZine sites, and several others as well as my own.

A lot of the stuff on my site is starting to get a bit dated. I should do some pruning when I get some time for it.

"Jerry Steiger" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@individual.net...

Thanks all for your response so far. Thought you might like an update of our findings. We now have exported our large machine assemblies as parasolid files and imported them into SolidEdge v17 and Pro/E WildfireII tryout versions. Then we have doubled and tripled the machine numbers within the assemblies. It's really a revelation to see the difference in performance between the two, when it comes to loading files, save, copy a machine within the assembly and such. Also drawing generation is several times faster with Pro/E. And then the 3D graphic environment is vastly more quick and distinct too. I can zoom and turn the massive machine layout like it was just one little part with Pro/E, while SolidEdge lags and show long delays in zoom performance from the scroll wheel and generally feels more like struggling in syrup. I don't have a Quadro card, but the Nvidia gForce

7800GTX, and with Pro/E I can see no need whatsoever for a more expensive video card. The 2D drawing environment in SolidEdge is to die for though. How do all you guys who don't have that, draw hydraulic schemes and such? With AutoCad? Another thing we have realised during these tests is a critical need for an update from 100 Mbit to Gigabit speed in the server network. Local kept files are treated several times faster than files kept on the server. This spells many minutes every time for loading and saving large assemblies. All the best, /per

Did you try importing the parasolids back into SolidWorks? I'm sure you would notice speed improvements after importing back into SolidWorks as the solids would now be dumb without a feature tree.

I might be wrong but I don't think this a fair comparison.

John Layne