2 questions

First I saw in this month Walthers flyer "I" gauge. What is that?
Second: Did SP ever have any observation cars with the open end platform in
Daylight colors?
Tim
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One gauge is about twice the size as O gauge. It is a gauge that basically went out of style back in the '30s or so due to how big it was. The Daylight train on the SP started out in the '20s and used heavyweight cars so an obsrvation with a rear platform was around. The color of the train was the typical dark green color at that time. The bright colors came about with the advent of the lightweight streamliner cars which never had an open observation on the tail. I do believe that a smoothsided car was built as a business car that carried the later silver with a red stripe above the windows which was the Daylight scheme at the time. The red/orange/black scheme really didn't last all that long and was more for just that one train than anything else. Other named trains of the SP also had their own special scheme that was different than the Daylight scheme.
-- Why isn't there an Ozone Hole at the NORTH Pole?
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Bob May wrote:

Isn't 1 gauge (45mm) used for garden railways? (a.k.a. "G")
(Disclaimer: I'm not a large-scaler, so don't take my word for it).
-- Kizhe
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I believe you are essentially correct, and that would mean the scale isn't really out of style. However, I have always been confused by the scale and gauge used to identify this type of locomotive. Suffice it to say that I don't live in a climate that is conducive to garden railroading, and I don't have room for it inside! ;-)
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On Fri, 15 Apr 2005 13:27:42 -0400, "Lt. Kizhe Catson"

Gauge 1 is 10mm:ft or 3/8":ft scale running on 45mm track. G scale runs on the same gauge of track but usually has models of narrow gauge prototypes, so the scale can vary quite a bit.
Jim.
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Guage 1 is twice the size of S. Roger Aultman
Jim Guthrie wrote:

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Jim Guthrie wrote:

10mm/1foot in the UK. 1:32 in Europe.

There _isn't_ a "G Scale", it's "G gauge". If the scale varies a bit with the prototype gauge represented, then it isn't a set scale.
Regards, Greg.P.
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Thanks. That was the first time I had ever heard of that scale. Popular with the British I'm sure.
If you can find a picture of that observation car in any of the SP colors I would be grateful
Tim

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On Fri, 15 Apr 2005 20:45:14 GMT, "Tim Coyle"
Tim,

http://www.gaugeone.org/index.htm
Jim.
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I'm going to have to look at that ad again. I'm sure it said "I" not 1.
wrote:

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Tim Coyle wrote:

That's a Roman "1" which is written as "I". 2 = II 3= III 4 = IV 5 = V

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No. First the series starts with zero = "O" gauge, and the Romans had no zero. Second, the authority on old toys, Louis Hertz, says the old gauges were designated by Arabic numbers 0, 1, 2, etc., not Roman. Gary Q
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Geezer wrote:

You're reading the wrong authority! At the Leipzig fair in 1891, Maerklin introduced the first standardized gauges, those being 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 or I, II, III, IV and V. (Maerklin have designated them in Roman and Aribic characters at different times) From memory, it was at the Leipzig fair of 1900 that they added gauge 0, which as you say had no Roman character designation. That places "0" as the _sixth_ standardised gauge, not the first.
Regards, Greg.P.
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Geezer wrote:

True, but for some reason the roman I for Gauge 1 has been used off and on in the UK. Perhaps because Gauge zero (0) was seen as Gauge O?
Also, while Hertz was very good on US history of toy/model tains, he was shaky on European history, except insofar as it affected the US hobby. A better (but still not 100% reliable) source on early toy and model trains in the UK and Europe was Henry Greenly (who also advised would-be modellers to round off the millimeter -> foot conversions, so that 4mm scale on 16.5 mm gauge is due largely to him.) This habit continues, hence the 10mm = 1ft scale for Gauge I/1. In some cases, this habit has prompted an exact scale, such as 16mm = 1ft for two foot narrow gauge modelled on O gauge track. I've yet to find a good European source - on the Continent, toy/model train books seem to be written by journalists with at best a spectator's interest in the hobby -- their efforts are merely expanded Sunday Supplement articles, with lots of pretty pictures, and lots of errors and misleading claims, often coupled with thinly disguised puff for certain manufacturers.
Keith Wills' articles in RMC are very good IMO - Wills doesn't shy from admitting ignorance or uncertainty, and occasionally does follow-ups based on information received from his readers.
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Tim Coyle wrote:

I as in roman numerals: I, II, III, IV, ....
[...]
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No. 1 gauge, or at least the size track it runs on, is very popular in the USA. Pick up a copy of "Garden Railways" and check it out. I think it as passed O gauge in popularity.
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The following amplifies Mr. May's comments:

After 4/18/1930, the heavyweight Daylight was painted in light "pearl" gray with darker gray lettering. Richard Wright's Daylight book indicates that the three heavyweight open platform observation cars assigned to the Daylight ( Nos. 2903-2905) were the first cars to receive the pearl gray paint scheme.

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See the following photos of various SP open platform business cars in the silver with red scheme:
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-b100ags.jpg
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-bus-car.jpg
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-b140ags.jpg
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/sp/sp-bc150agd.jpg

The Ryan & Shine book on SP Night Trains mentions that, "Some of the last open platform observation cars [on the SP] were assigned to the "Coaster" [train #69-70] in 1946 and 1947." These included a Pullman heavyweight 10 sect-obs in late '46, and SP owned smoker-lounge-obs cars 2913-2915 in '47, apparently just in dark green paint. Gary Q
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I will have to see if I can get my hands on that book. I'm hoping to model SP passenger service between N California to Portland OR. from the mid 40s to late 50s.
Tim

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Tim Its Gauge 1. That would be 1/32 scale using G gauge track This is the correct scale when using G gauge track to represent standard gauge. Now for my own question. Why do some manufactures make 1/29 scale standard gauge equipment for G gauge track. I'm hoping there is an intelligent or reasonable explanation for this odd ball scale to be used. Bruce

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Bruce Favinger wrote:

The marketing reason would appear to be that G gauge modellers will be more readily tempted by standard gauge models that have a similar cross section to their narrow gauge models. ie no reasonable explanation!
Regards, Greg.P.

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