Help: Painting Rolling Stock

In most of the wooden ones I've seen, the inside was raw wood. The floor was raw wood on the inside, and sometimes underneath. Other times I've seen what appeared to be a creosote treatment underneath, but it may have just been old dirty, oily paint :-)

On Sun, 8 Feb 2004 19:55:46 UTC, "Wolf Kirchmeir" wrote: 2000

The material was "car cement" an asphalt like material. It was normally black but could be colored. It was also used on roofs and ends. Apparently it cured hard.

On Mon, 9 Feb 2004 05:02:55 UTC, "Wolf Kirchmeir" wrote: 2000

There is a very interesting writeup in 'Railway Prototype Cyclopedia' vol 3 on the painting of boxcars. This is where I found out about car cement. The article says it is similar to automotive undercoating. They have pictures of the application of paint and car cement.

I f any of you are not familiar with the 'Railway Prototype Cyclopedia' it is an extremely informative source. They are up to volume 9. They cover a wide range of subjects such as boxcar painting, pullmans, freight car trucks, passenger car trucks etc. They run about $21 each. The photographs are excellent and the text is informative. Their research is supposed to be excellent. I have no interest in the outfit other than as a more than satisfied user.

Let's assume your prototype is wood and the kit is a plastic molded one (rather than a stick built wooden model). In that case I'd paint the outside and the roof "boxcar red" for which I use a spray can of red auto primer from the auto parts store. I'd do the trucks with it too. It dries dead flat and sticks well. For the interior I'd assume unpainted wood weathered out to a driftwood gray, a wood floor about the same shade, maybe darker from spills of this and that. There is a light gray auto primer spray can, again from the auto parts store. The undercarriage ought to be a darker gray, also flat, for which, there is a dark gray auto primer. With these three colors I have been able do most freight cars. I'd prep the plastic for painting with a good wash in hot soapy water (trip through the dish washer will do fine). Don't touch the plastic with your bare hands after washing it. The flat auto primer takes decals well. You want a shot of Dullcote over the decals to make them blend in properly.

David J. Starr

David,

The auto primer sounds interesting. I got a few questions though.

From a spray can do you get a good thin coat that will not hide small detail?

How far away do you hold the can for best results?

How many coats are generally needed?

How long does it take to dry well?

What's brand do you suggest?

Can you get the stuff in jars to air brush with? And is there a white that could be used to lighten the red and grays if you wanted to use an air brush?.

If you want to do a wash or drybrush highlights what is best to use that will not harm the primer coat?

Thanks, Bruce

I can't imagine much would touch primer. The stuff takes automotive lacquer over top of it, and solvent-wise, that's pretty "hot" stuff.

Jay CNS&M North Shore Line - "First and fastest"

I have used flat white and black in spray cans and I get good coverage without detail obliteration. I like using the flat white as a primer coat.

I like to stip shells before painting. I am always concerned about the solvents and the base plastic, so I air brush a barrier coat of acrylic floor polish like futura or beacon which is made to restore the gloss to a no wax floor. Once I do this, I don't have to worry about the solvents crazing the plastic surfaces.

The flats like white and black don't build up like the gloss paints so you can easily give a shell 3-4 coats without a paint build up.

Within about 8 hours at room temp, I can easily go ahead and go on to other painting of the shell. If I was going to use a complex pattern where tape was on the surface as a masking pattern, I would wait a few days until the paint set well. A good guide is when the paint odor has dissapaited from the model.

Get the cheapest stuff from Wal Mart.

When spray can bombs get down to the bottom of the can and they don't produce a good aerosol spray, I drill a small hole in the top side of the can to release the propellant. When the gas is released, I widen the hole and pour the remaining paint into glass jars.

I can mix the flat white with other colors and thin them out for spraying in my airbrush. The airbrush produces an even better finish and uses less paint.

Once the paints are cured and dried, a wash that uses water based acrylics will never harm the paint. Even dry brushing with solvent based paints will be safe on the painted surfaces.

As always, experiment on scrap plastic or shells to see how things work out before you invest your time and resources in the final project.

Have fun, Ed

Hold the can steady. Sweep the spray along the carbody with a steady motion, keep it moving at the same speed. Get the spray going before it's hitting the car, sweep it steadily down the car and don't shut it off til it is clear of the car at the other end. You are looking for a coat just wet enough to sort of flow together, but not so wet it sags and runs. If too far away, the paint dries in flight and you get a dusty look. Too close and the spray hasn't spread enough to give even coverage across the car. If you avoid sags and runs, the paint will dry thin enough for all the rivets to be counted and it will look very good.

The primers cover well with just one coat. That's the difference between paint and primer. Primers have lots of pigment so they will cover just about anything in one coat. Something like yellow often won't cover in one coat, you need two coats to keep the underneath "stuff" from showing through the paint. Something like yellow or white will look much better over a coat of light colored primer than it will over black plastic. I do just simple color schemes, say an all red box car or a black steam locomotive. I've never tried a multi colored, mask three coats, fancy diesel paint job this way, and I would worry that by the time I had the last coat on, it might be too thick.

It will dry enough for light handling in 20 minutes or so. I try to let any paint dry overnight before decals, or a second coat, just on general principles.

You can't go wrong with Krylon or Rustoleum. I just looked in my paint box, I have a lot of that, some Ace hardware, a can of "Painters Touch". The hardware store house brands seem to work just fine. I've done a fair number of plastic models with all makes of spray cans and never had trouble with the paint crazing the plastic. Once I did have trouble with a can of clear satin which I tried to use in place of Dullcote. That stuff made the decals crinkle up, reducing what was going to be a pretty decent car, to a just average also-ran model. I've stuck with Dull Cote since then.

Yes. If you have a air brush, it will give you better control of the spray and in general do a better job. The usual model railroad paints (floquil and company) make primers. I have a jar of floquil Zinc Chromate primer that I used to prime wire handrails on a GP30 before painting them white. It probably dries to a pretty good box car red. On the other hand floquil and pollyscale make box car red that covers well and certainly will dry to a fine box car red.

The primers are formulated to survive over coats of automobile lacquer, which is pretty active stuff. I cannot imagine having trouble from dry brushing anything, or using any kind of wash. At least a wash made with a reasonable solvent, alcohol, paint thinner or lacquer thinner. If you went really crazy and used something like MEK for a solvent you might have trouble, but that's sort of beyond the pale.

David Starr

David and Ed, I've got an Accurail wood box car that I'm re-detailing and will give the spray can primer a shot on this. I've got six more so if I mess up its no big loss. If it works out I'll save a lot of fooling around and clean up using the air brush. Thanks, Bruce