Serious dust problem

Doesn't Home Depot have some sort of Concrete Sealer? Either that or a thin layer of new concrete to smooth out the old floor.

If the sealer suggested in the other reply doesn't do the job, consider putting down tile or linoleum.

Jeff, A possible second choice to pouring a floor and my be ok if the earth below is stable would be to use inexpensive sand mix to about 3/4 to 1" over the floors. You can build this up in small sections. Sand mix is easy to work with and holds in place so you can slope and float it if you have to drop the floor level to accommodate doors or other areas with a lower finished floor. This would give you a number of cold joints and help prevent fracturing if something shifts. Over this you could use an anti fracture membrane. The membrane will not stop the floor below from fracturing if the ground shifts but will help prevent the flooring material above from cracking if its tile or vinyl and keep you from walking on completely crumbled material below whatever floor covering you use. I have an old shed that my work shop and train room are in. It has plywood floors. The floor was like a roller coaster and in a few spots just a bit springy. I knew in the springy areas that a leveling bed would crack sooner or later. I covered the floors with plastic sheet and flashed it up the walls a few inches. Then used sand mix to lay square areas of about

4'x4' with a trial and level to keep it all smooth. My depth varied due to the floor from about 2" to 1/4". Next I use a very thin application of Custom Building Products self leveling mortar. Then Laticrete 9235 as a membrane because I had some. Last the floors were covered with Johnsonite commercial rubber tile. Rubber is much more durable than vinyl flooring, lots less dusty than carpet, and not as hard on the feet as sealed concrete. It is also very resilient and forgiving of imperfect surfaces. So far so good and the floors have remained solid and firm above and below except for one small spot that if you step on it you can hear a slight grind but its been that way for almost two years and the flooring has stayed intact due to the plastic sheet below and the membrane above. Bruce

Jeff Finch wrote:

Start by making small piles of the dust around the room with a shovel and/or push broom. Try not to raise the dust in the air. You should wear a face mask. After you pick up the piles, inspect the floor for pieces of concrete which are approximately one square foot or less and are no longer connected to the main section. You can't walk on pieces that small without disturbing them, so they need to be removed. You can break them up with a sledge hammer. Also pick up the loose chips and flakes of cement on top of the concrete. Vacuum the entire floor well. Make sure the vacuum has a bag that can trap the remaining cement dust, otherwise it will be blown all over the basement. Fill the areas where the dirt (ground) is showing with new concrete mix. You might have to add or remove some dirt so the new concrete will be the same thickness as the surrounding old layer. Be sure to level the new concrete areas before the mix sets by moving a 2 X 4 back and forth over it. This is called 'screeding'. Then patch all the cracks in the old concrete with patch mix and a pointed masonry trowel. Do the same with the areas where you removed loose flakes of cement from the top. Finally, paint the floor with a *quality* latex floor paint. It will cost at least $30 a gallon in most cases. There are special paints for concrete but they're not necessary if you have a dry basement. If you want a better/harder paint than latex, consider epoxy paint. However this may require etching the concrete with Muriatic acid before painting. You can get more information on this from a home supply store like Lowes or Home Depot. Good luck.

I painted my concrete garage floor with Sherwin/Williams 2-part epoxy floor paint WITHOUT doing the acid wash thing and it is fine except for a couple of small spots after 7 years. The acid wash really isn't needed unless you have grease/oil spots or something like that going on. Just make sure it is mopped and wiped clean and give any new concrete patch work a month to set up before painting. While this is going against the instructions on the can in my own experience it will work fine. That acid is a real B**** to work with!

But ABSOLUTELY deal with the dusty floor before putting in a layout. You will deeply regret not doing so.

-John

Jeff,

Think not in terms of the future time when your layout is completed, but when you come to the point where you may have to sell the house.

Imagine yourself as a prospective buyer, and you're touring the house because you're thinking of buying it. Let's assume for a moment, the main living areas are attractive to as a buyer, the kitchen is in great shape with late-model appliances, etc.

Then you look at the cellar. To your buyer's eyes you see something two steps removed from a dirt floor. Would YOU buy that house, seeing how much work would have to be done just to get that basement space "presentable"? As a prospective buyer, you say, "No way," and move on to the next house.

The point at which I'm getting is this: for you, as the current owner, it might be in your interest to engage in some SERIOUS excavation/reconstruction work to replace the present floor, perhaps removing a couple of inches to gain some additional headroom, provided the geography and topography where you live permit it. While it would certainly make for a preferable layout room, it would go a long way toward your home's resale value ten, twenty or thirty years down the road. While you may end up tearing down your beloved Plywood Northern, you will be able to command a higher price for your property than you otherwise could. (Layouts actually reduce a home's resale value.) This is the general rule of thumb that governs real estate: the better you make your property, the greater its resale value, should that time come.

Dieter Zakas Resale, NJ

One other solution is to use pourable Latex Floor leveling mixture. Not only will it bridge the small cracks, but also give you a level floor. If you have large cracks and the dirt is visible, then this will not work. Flooring companies use this all the time to level floors in new buildings as well as renovation projects. Then put either tile or carpet down over the entire floor. You can use carpet tiles so that you can always get to the floor below if required.

I'd probably want more headroom so I'd go and dig the basement out. A workshop vacuum cleaner can do the majority of cleanup of the dust and dirt while some good work at breaking up concrete will do the rest. I'd probably dig down a good 8-9" just to get a few inches of headroom and then pour a 4" or more floor of good quality. Pain in the butt but then you will have something a lot better for a floor to work on.

-- Bob May Losing weight is easy! If you ever want to lose weight, eat and drink less. Works every time it is tried!

"Bruce Favinger" tickled the keyboard:

I'm not familiar with this product. Could you provide a bit more information?

I assume this is what you used. Are there others? Does it come in sheets/rolls like plastic?

Not to mention possibly more resilient and maybe easier on dropped rolling stock?

Thanks to the other suggestions as well. As relates to resale, I hope I don't have to deal with this but one never knows. I am never one to just do something because it's quick and easy. It has to be correct as well as look good. All useful advise and I welcome any additional comments y'all might have.

Jeff

Jeff, Laticrete 9235 is a fluid applied membrane. Its rolled on with paint rollers then the mesh that comes with the bucket is laid out and the fluid is applied again over this. The whole installation is not more than 1/8 inch thick. If your floor is cracked but other wise appears to be solid may be able to caulk any cracks and apply 9235 directly or just skim coat the floor and then put down the 9235. It is a commercial product used mostly in wet areas like kitchens and large showers. It is a waterproofing product so it will seal the floor. It also has the properties of an anti fracture membrane. Its basically liquid that turns to rubber that mortar or most flooring glues will stick to extremely well. The cost is about $300 for a full unit and that will do about 250 square feet. Not cheap but its an excellent product. If you want to read the spec's on it go to Laticrete.com and see what you think. They have other products that maybe useful to you as well. Laticrete is widely distributed and you can get it at most commercial ceramic tile outlets like Dal Tile or probably through Home Depot. Another line of flooring products is Custom Building Products. Both of these companies cater to the ceramic tile trade but have useful products. You can also call their support numbers and get help or recommendations. Just remember they will tell you the best way to do it. With my own floors I did what was the cheapest thing I could get away with that I thought would work. Bruce

"Jeff Finch" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com...

"Bruce Favinger" tickled the keyboard:

Bruce,

Thanks again for the helpful information. Especialy since your application seems to be a good test case and you've had good results. I'll definitly research this product some more along with information I got from people on the Old House email list in which I also participate. There are a couple of products specifically made for basements that fit the resiliency requirement but need a pretty flat, sound surface, which a skim coat of sand mix with the Laticrete on top may supply.