Fixed stop signal?

"Chris"


Fair enough. :-)
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Roger T.
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Roger T. wrote:

The vast majority of level crossing are occupation crossings with no protection and require the user to contact the signalman before use.
Chris
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A few years ago, driving along a narrow back road through farmland in East Yorkshire, I came upon a gated crossing with a notice instructing drivers to blow their horn for the crossing keeper. Before I could do so, a man appeared from a shed behind the adjacent cottage, donning his reflective jacket, and manually opened the gates for us. I presume he had a means of knowing when the next train was due. I hope so, because it was the electrified ECML!
In North America, most unguarded crossings simply have the warning "STOP - LOOK - LISTEN" (if any). School bus drivers are required by law to do so even at crossings with automatic gates, warning lights and bells. Most buses and coaches have a sign on the back: "This vehicle stops at all railway crossings". They even have to stop at disused crossings if they haven't been officially decomissioned.
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Martin S.

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MartinS wrote:

In those cases they generally have repeaters of the block instruments in the shed between the two neighbouring signal boxes or track circuit repeaters in TC block areas.
Chris
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What? Not in North America they don't.
First, there's almost no such thing anymore as a "signalbox/tower" as almost all the routes that have any form of signals are controlled from a central "dispatch office" and secondly, the placing of grade crossings and signals (If they exist) are in now way related to each other and are in no way interlocked with each other. Besides, back when they had "towers" they were only located at "interlockings" and so could be dozens of 20, 30, 40 or more miles apart. We never (Very rarely) had "towers" spaced every few miles as signalboxes were in the UK.
At "controlled" grade crossings, the only things that might be interlocked with each other are road traffic lights and the grade crossing signals as it' every common to find grade crossings running diagonally through cross roads controlled by traffic lights, or have two street each running parallel to each other, about 100 feet apart, with the single track line running between them and grade crossings every block of so that may, or may not, be controlled by traffic lights, grade crossing flashers, grade crossing gates or nothing at all other than cross bucks and a "Stop, Look, Listen" sign.
North America is more "relaxed" on grade crossing and rail safety than in the UK, for example.
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Roger T.
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I was a little confused too, But I think Chris was responding to the first part of my post (which you snipped) regarding the manually- controlled crossing I encountered in the UK.
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Martin S.

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Ah yes. Then in that case what he wrote makes sense.
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Roger T.
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Roger T. wrote:

Yes that was what I was replying to. A good snip changes the meaning.
Chris
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The other thing they have to do at every level crossing in the States is to sound the whistle. They have to blow two long blasts, a short and another long which is the letter Q in mores. They adopted this from the British Navy. If a ship had Queen Victoria on board they would sound a Q to tell other ships that they had the Queen on board and had right of way.
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Keith W
Sunbury on Thames
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"Keith W" <

In North America (Why with the UK is it always the USA?) _all_ locomotive use of the whistle/horns is governed by rule 14 which at one time, before radios, had a long list of whistle signals that were used to communicate between the train's crew, other locomotive/train crews and as warning signals.
The fact that rule 14L, long-long-short-long is the Morse letter "Q" is just a coincidence and has nothing to do with the RN. If fact, as we all know, the US goes out of it's way to make sure it doesn't do anything the same as is done in the UK.
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Roger T.
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Keith W wrote:

There are a number of cities in the US that have a no horn law in urban areas with automatic barriers and very high train frequency. There are still crossings with whistle boards mostly ungated automatic crossings and footpath crossings.
BTW the British navy has always been known as the Royal Navy (RN) :;
Chris
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Again, in North America (Why always the USA?) this is not uncommon. Municipal bylaws can ban the use of the whistle within city limits or at certain grade crossing but only if said crossing(s) are protected by a crossing equipped with the full compliment of lights, bells and half barriers or, perhaps it's full barriers, I'm not 100% sure on that point.
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Roger T.
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Half barriers. Now you are 100%.
It can take several years to get approval through various government boards and committees, plus CN and/or CP, including details of funding for improvements.
I should have read the full thread first...
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In Canada, at least, a municipality can decide, subject to approval by the Canadian Transport Commission, to ban train whistles at crossings, except in case of emergency or workers on the line. This often involves upgrading the crossings to a minimum standard, including bells and lifting barriers and zig-zag barriers for pedestrians.
Toronto has banned level crossing whistles for years, not that there are many left on main roads. My home town, traversed by one CP and two CN lines in close proximity and having 4 level crossings with 90 trains per day, banned whistles about 5 years ago, resulting in a rise in real estate values.
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Martin S.

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Roger T. wrote:

In the UK most lines are controlled by power signal boxes fully gated crossings are interlocked with signals and half barrier crossings at stations. Something similar applies on US lines that carry substantial passenger traffic such as in the North East. Crossing protection on freight only lines is much more relaxed as you say.
Chris
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Except in North America, grade crossings are, in 99.99% of the time, not interlocked with the railway signals and signals are placed with no regard for the position of grade crossings. If the grade crossing malfunctions, the only warning the loco crew have of malfunction grade crossing is a visual one. If the grade crossing red lights are not flashing then they will (Or may not) see the small tell-tale white lights on the sides of the flashers are not flashing or will (Or may not) see that the barriers, if any, are not down.
Many, many times, you will get railway signals placed such that the train will stop and block the grade crossing because the train crosses the grade crossing and then comes up to the signal.
Direction of travel ---->
===== crossing=======signal====
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Cheers.

Roger T.
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...
Back closer to topic, was sure read something about fixed stop signals recently so reluctantly retarced recent researches (reluctant cos spend hours reading interesting bits). Little nugget on fixed distance is Bound of LMS decreed as far as the driver is concerned there should be nodifference in physical appearence between a fixed or working distant. Dont know if they went as far as dummy rods though.
cheers, Simon
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I know of some road traffic lights that never change colour, although the head has the usual 3 aspects. E.g., there is a changeable signal to regulate left turns, but the straight through signal always shows green.
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Martin S.

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wrote...

Thats blown that attempt to get it back OT :-) but heres another. How many people knew LMS ground signals were used to control movements against the normal flow of traffic - admit I didnt !
Cheers, Simon
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On Fri, 09 Oct 2009 11:04:23 +0100, simon wrote:

Surely that's what ground signals (dummies) are for? Except for the GWR for a while (and doubtless some other companies), under absolute block signalling a wrong-road movement cannot be signalled using a 'normal' signal (obvioulsy single-lines have their own arrangements), so dummies are used. I believe using dummies for right-road movements is relatively recent - prior to that calling-on arms and a plethora of other such signals were used for right-road movements where the line to the next signal might not be clear (permissive loops excepted).
Cheers Richard
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I have become...............comfortably numb

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