Is it all a waste of money?

Well my layout is a very accessible 'roundy-roundy' and is adjacent to my workshop and admin area. I generally play once or twice a week for a half hour or so, apart from testing rolling stock which can happen any time and last as long as it takes to get good running. I have a lot of nice coaching stock and goods trains which my wife likes to look at when bringing me tea, so I rotate the ten or so rakes of stock round the layout. If I have visitors of course, up to a couple of hours will go in a flash as they generally want to see everything.

Alistair Wright '5522' Models

Thanks for your reply to which out of curiosity I googled for 5522 Models only to find that they have ceased trading.

This is not true. The S4 Society used to host my pages, but when I left after an outrageous and libellous episode on their e group, which they refused to do anything about, they removed my pages and put up that message. I can't get them to change it AFAIK. If you would like a list of '5522' products - mostly LMS and constituents coach kits plus a few GWR items - I can send you one. I have a healthy set of customers all over the world who know I'm still around and able to supply their needs. If you were on Model Rail Forum you would know that I recently re-launched my Stove 'R' kit, and if the Dapol 4mm one doesn't happen (and it isn't looking likely) I expect to supply some more kits for that vehicle. '5522' is not the cheapest kit manufacturer but I like to think it is the best LMS coach producer and certainly the most accurate. There are no doubt a few mean-minded individuals in the S4 Soc who think they have wrecked my business but they are wrong. I do not need to advertise, as all my business comes from word of mouth from satisfied customers.

Alistair Wright '5522' Models

Have you tried?

I would have a polite word with their ISP, or the regsitrant, and threatan legal action on the grounds its affecting your business, if it isn't removed. I would also demand an apology be posted in its place for, say, 12 months.

Details are here

I'm surprised, unless there's more to it than you're telling us.

MBQ

When I was getting back into the hobby 30 years ago there were two

18.83mm societies. You would go to shows and see signs on stands saying members of the other society would not be served.

Unfortunately if you are the victim of a libel, it is you who has to take action, and you have to do so within 2 years of the offending publication.

However, this does not necessarily apply in the case of Internet publication, because every time that someone new sees the erroneous material (as in my experience today), a new publication occurs and a new libel is created.

The site which I read, and which was the first in the list from google is

but it is important to stress that I am informing you about the source of the info and not inducing others to read it.

What is strange is the claim that someone else is now providing the models.

I did not know anything about you until you were gracious enough to respond to my posts, and the first thing that I read about you is what you now suggest is a scurrilous calumny.

If they are saying that you have ceased trading and you have not done so, then it would be a clear case of libel, and you must take action against it.

Do not worry if they then claim to be a company limited by guarantee (fairly normal in the case of social clubs to limit the members' liabilities to £1 each) because the directors of that company have no such limit on their liability. ie. In respect of their individual memberships, the directors' liability is only £1, but in respect of their directorships, their liability is unlimited.

However, IANAL ("I am not a lawyer") so take advice on this.

I do not know the events that lead up to this "outrageous and libellous episode ", but whatever happened, there are only a few restricted defences allowed for libel cases. If they have deliberately published something which they know to be false, then they have no defence in law, and you can expect damages of such a level such that the directors would have to sell their houses.

But, I repeat, IANAL.

I suggest that you in the first instance get your solicitor to send a notice-before-action requiring the false material to be removed, an apology and retraction to be published in its place and published to this newsgroup, and to demand damages now of, say, £10,000, failing which you will pursue them through the courts. But do get your solicitor to do it, because they'll think that you are bluffing if you do it yourself.

Christopher A. Lee wrote: [...]

Ah, that explains why there were no common standards for commercial model railways.

"United we stand, divided we fail."

cheers, wolf k.

In which case I willingly, unreservedly, unconditionally and without being under any duress retract my comments above and apologise to you for making them.

Alistair W

PS What has all this got to do with wasting money?

: > Thanks for your reply to which out of curiosity I googled for

5522 Models : > only : > to find that they have ceased trading. : >

: >

: This is not true. The S4 Society used to host my pages, but when I left : after an outrageous and libellous episode on their e group, which they : refused to do anything about, they removed my pages and put up that message. : I can't get them to change it AFAIK.

Some cheapo web hosting and web space, together with a domain name (the most logical one is available, according to a WHOIS look-up), plus a curt comment about the S4 society seems well in order - together with some good search engine optimising - that might make them think again...

But that is the silly thing, in 18.83mm (P4/S4) there is but only one standard, this long running dispute is more about personalities than standards... :~(

: : "United we stand, divided we fail." :

Hasn't happened yet and the 18.83mm track standards must be 45 years old now.

"> Some cheapo web hosting and web space, together with a domain

On you go then. I'm not wasting any more of my valuable time on them. Be my guest.

Alistair

: On you go then. I'm not wasting any more of my valuable time on them. Be my : guest. :

So you don't want to advertise YOUR business and model kits then? Duh!...

No, not strange at all. Andy Copp (Lochgorm Kits) was one of my Highland Railway customers. He offered to take the HR business over as I was getting tired of filling boxes and traipsing down to the Post Office. My main interest is designing kits, and the shop-keeping aspect was always a pain, so selling off two bits of it - the Highland ( to Andy) and Caledonian kits (to Caley Coaches) - was a good move from my point of view. Andy is doing a great job - expanding the range (I do a bit of design consultancy) and having a good time going to shows which I hated. I'd love to get shot of the LMS business as well, but so far no one has come forth with the kind of money it is worth. I want to get on with my own layout. I think I've done my bit for the hobby and in any case kit building is an endangered activity with all this good RTR around. No one in his right mind will kit build anything which is available RTR. Still leaves a lot of kits of course - MR, LNWR, G&SWR, Furness, etc, etc but the niche is narrowing.

Alistair W

"> So you don't want to advertise YOUR business and model kits then?

You are not reading my contributions very well.:-) I have already said that I get lots of business from existing customers - as much as I can cope with. I made it clear to all of them that they could order anything from the catalogue. They also introduce their friends from time to time. Why would I spend money (and time) advertising? '5522' has aspects of a 'club' now, but anyone can join if they are interested in making nice LMS coaches. I got very litle business from S4 folk anyway, but the pages they hosted did sometimes bring in odd outsiders. I do the odd article in magazines - did you see the one on building LMS articulated coaches in 'Model Rail' for instance? I was never in this business to make big money. I am more interested in advancing the technology.

Alistair W

: You are not reading my contributions very well.:-)

I could suggest that you didn't express yourself very well the first time... :~)

All is clear now though.

Alistair, As a member of the S4 soc I invite you to contact snipped-for-privacy@greenandred.co.uk and hopefully resolve your problem. I gather that it refers to your heated exchanges with the rather outspoken CLAG gang in 2005.

I am just an interfering old fart who would rather that people were just a tad more tolerate in a world now armed with nuclear words and an easy means of delivering them!

Best Regards Peter A Montarlot France

Comment on exhibitors welcoming to autistic child at shows >> comment on unwelcoming exhibitors >> comment on EM /S4/P4 refusing to deal with other at shows >> and here we are.

:-)

wolf k.