Ratio coach kits

Alistair W

Laccy bands?

This was supposed to be a practice till get proper kit !

Got me confused there till realised thats the distance between axles :-) I need to be sensible, how can I get 4 of the 10ft ones ?

You could be my saviour Simon

: >> Cheers, : >> Simon : >>Sensible people buy '5522' MR etched bogies (both 8ft and

10ft are : >>available) which are far more durable and much easier to assemble. These : >>were designed to suit Ratio coaches after I heard many complaints about : >>the plastic ones. : >

: > Alistair W : This was supposed to be a practice till get proper kit ! : : Got me confused there till realised thats the distance between axles :-) : I need to be sensible, how can I get 4 of the 10ft ones ? : : You could be my saviour : Simon :

I would try the obvious, found at the top of Alistair's messages (first line quoted in your message), see if it bounces back or you get a reply! :~)

You could turn som aluminium rods/bars to the correct spacing between the sideframes and then gently clamp the bogie parts around 2 or 3 of those. (rubber bands) Don't mind making you some, but there could be someone closer than NZ with a lathe.

Greg.P.

This was supposed to ba a cheap, quick practice run before trying decent brass/etched kit. Only cost GBP8 from ebay. If looked good then would do another to run as 2 coach local behind Johnson 1P. Recon time to give up on ratio bogies - or at least this one - and either get some decent ones or hack some hornby or bachmann replacements that have found. If cut off some of the extra fittings then theyre a bit deeper with bigger axle boxes and springs but maybe theyll do !

Cheers, Simon

If you really want a cheap practice run at etched kits can I suggest that you contact Lochgorm Kits and get one of his 'beginner's frets' which produces a simple box wagon (LMS or LNER to taste)and which contains all the exercises you will need to be able to accomplish before you move on to more expensive kits. I designed this fret about five years ago and it sold about

360 units in a very short time. I think the fret is still around GBP6 which won't break the bank.Lochgorm will have sold even more I guess. I hope that many of them were built and led to people trying more complicated kits. Lochgorm have a website. pm me if you would like to see built examples of this fret. '5522' Models

Alistair W

The offer still stands for aluminium spacers - you'd have to tell me the precise length you need though. Alister's suggestion of the test etch looks good.

Greg.P.

Thanks for suggestion but was practice for coach rather than ethched kit. May contact you when ready for decent midland coach though.

cheers, Simon

Thanks for that kind offer, managed with bit of wood and bit more patience.

cheers, simon

You've got me confused here. You build 'plastic' bogies as a precursor to tackling etched kits? Then you imply that trying out your skills on a cheap etched wagon kit is not what you had in mind and you're going straight for a coach kit?. Personally at your stage I would not dream of buying an etched coach kit (my '5522' kits cost nigh on GBP50 with bogies) unless I was confident I could build it. SWMBO will be greatly annoyed if you spend all that dosh and don't get a result. I still say, buy Andy's beginner's fret (when I was selling it, most folk bought two, it was so cheap) it is the place to start your voyage into real kit building. Get up to speed on tidy soldering etc and then move slowly into more complicated projects. Etched brass is the Rolls-Royce method of making railway models. Durability is much greater than any plastic or whitemetal model. Appearance also - I don't mix etched and plastic stock in the same rake on my layout beacause the etched stuff looks so much crisper. BUT don't jump in at the deep end.

You may not realise it, but this newsgroup makes available to you hundreds of years of hard earned modelling experience, all of which is at your disposal. You ignore their advice at your own risk if you want to move quickly into skilled model railway building.

Alistair W

OK, havent had anywhere near your experience - was reading a letter you wrote to Modellers Backtrack in 1992 - but have done 3 craftsman brass steam loco kits that have turned out fine (for me). Although dont solder whitemetal, getting the chassis correct with soldering has given practice. Oh yes, most certainly realise the knowledge and experience available from this newsgroup. Got more useful info from here on chassis kit building than from 8 years of model magazines. Thanks esp to Paul and Jerry I have good running chassis that dont depend on luck during building :-)

So just wanted to do cheap plastic coach try and fall into as many traps as possible before an etched one. Have already realised need some simple jig for these bogies to ensure get them straight. Didnt need one for airfix mineral wagons. Hadnt planned on mixing etched and plastic in same rake - as said, plastic if ok would be for 2 car local behind Johnson 1P.

Cheers, Simon

: : So just wanted to do cheap plastic coach try and fall into as many traps as : possible before an etched one. Have already realised need some simple jig : for these bogies to ensure get them straight. Didnt need one for airfix : mineral wagons.

The thing is, and this is the point Alistair is making, building a (coach) plastic kit is nothing like building an etched (coach) kit - whilst it's true that basic modelling disciplines are valid to both (and indeed any modelling) the two disciplines are like chalk and cheese, hence his extremely valid comment about not diving in at the deep end. The usual modellers progression is; plastic > white metal > etched, but that isn't possible with coach kits [1], although many seem to progress thus; plastic > etched sides > complete etched kit. But even then most people will have gained soldering skills either vie white metal or the cheaper/simpler etched wagon kits. IYSWIM?

[1] or at least I'm not aware of any white metal coach kits.

K's

: >: : >: So just wanted to do cheap plastic coach try and fall into as : >many traps as : >: possible before an etched one. Have already realised need some : >simple jig : >: for these bogies to ensure get them straight. Didnt need one : >for airfix : >: mineral wagons. : >

: >The thing is, and this is the point Alistair is making, building : >a (coach) plastic kit is nothing like building an etched (coach) : >kit - whilst it's true that basic modelling disciplines are valid : >to both (and indeed any modelling) the two disciplines are like : >chalk and cheese, hence his extremely valid comment about not : >diving in at the deep end. The usual modellers progression is; : >plastic > white metal > etched, but that isn't possible with : >coach kits [1], although many seem to progress thus; plastic >

: >etched sides > complete etched kit. But even then most people : >will have gained soldering skills either vie white metal or the : >cheaper/simpler etched wagon kits. IYSWIM? : >

: >[1] or at least I'm not aware of any white metal coach kits. : : K's

???

Assuming the obvious; Someone is still selling/marketing "K's Kits"? I could do with a LBSCR K class - unless Hornby or Backmann have plans for 2010/11...

I had their GWR auto-caoch - it was awful. The sides and roof were in two parts that didn't uite line up so you could see the join. And you wou;dn't believe the friction in what passed for the bearings. As soon as Airfix introduced theirs I threw the old one away.

Try the West Coast Kit Centre. I understand they advertise in the Modeller.

You haven't seen my articles in the 1953/4 Railway Modeller then.:-)

- but have done 3 craftsman brass steam

Actually soldering whitemetal with LMP solder is quite a good introduction to soldering in general. If it isn't quite right, a basin of boiling water will reduce the mess back to a kit and you can start again! You are going to need good soldering skills for etched kits in general. Brass is a 'greasy' metal which does not glue well even with modern epoxys. Nickel Silver is worse.

As Jerry says you will learn nothing about etched coach kits from building plastic ones. For a start plastic is joined 'cold'. You will find that soldering up a large mass of brass requires a bit of careful thought. As the thing gains weight it gains thermal mass and ever higher wattages are needed to add the later parts. Whereupon some of the earlier bits may fall off. I very strongly recommend buying an expensive bit of kit, which you will never regret buying. It is a Resistance Soldering Unit. They cost £100+ these days, alas, and you never see them on ebay, the folk who have them never sell them. I'd sell my granny before I parted with mine. The frustration this gadget will save you is beyond explaining.

Mixing plastic and brass on the layout is, as I said, not advisable. My first etched kit was a Mallard LNWR Railmotor (it was so badly designed it got me into making my own kits) my second was my own kit for the LMS Inspection Saloon. What do these have in common? They are ONE vehicle trains and need never mix with other stock in a rake. I now have over 60 brass coaches and all my old kit built plastic stuff is off the layout, but that is history. I do have two trains of modern RTR plastic coaches because they are so good (LMS P3s by Hornby, and BR1s by Bachmann) but even they do not quite cut it when seen alongside etched stuff.

The current generation of modellers do have a dilemma. RTR is now so good that building kits for coaches available as RTR (and locos too) is pointless. No one will build them because the Tampo painting is so much better than even the best amateur efforts. Professional paint jobs will cost a lot and take years to get done as so few people are painting professionally now. However if you are modelling pre-group railways you will have to build kits. I recommend building in brass for long term stability (and value).

Alistair W

In article , Alistair Wright writes

Do you know where these can be bought? I have spent some time looking for one - the £100+ is not a problem, but not being able to find one in this country is!

David