New Haas Controller...

Iny Haas peeple here? Inyone on AMC at all?? LOL
I just got a Haas GR510, and boy, haas ain't exactly quick on the trigger
for training, getting you up and running.
So far, altho the haas controller eclipses the Fadal 88CS ito bells/whistles, I must say the 88CS is much quicker, more "ergonomic" to use, proly half the keystrokes. I don't find the haas controller terribly intuitive, either. Altho the colors are nice.... LOL
Reminds me of Xywrite, the NYTimes/Atex derivative wordprocessor ca. 1985-90, proly THE finest word processor in the world. Hooray NYT!! Then along came fuknWindows..... Now, you cain't even get a readable directory tree any more.... or adjust the g-d idle on yer car, for that matter.....
Inyway, just looking for a place to ax Dumb Haas Qs.... Mebbe I'll have to go to PM, eh? I spose I should bug the dealer as well, eh? lol A succinct tutorial on the more common operations would be nice, but god forbid haas would provide one. Hunted around a bit, have seen where others have asked for this, as well, some dope referred them back to the haas site. Brilliant.... unless I missed sumpn....
--
EA



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windows, which allowed you to actually see what was going to come out of the printer first, and not have to guess or locate weird printer drivers for each program.
wordperfect 6 was cute in the WYSIWYG mode, but printing was still trial and error.
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wrote:

Yeah, graphics was an issue.... But, did you ever use Xywrite?? If you did, you'd know what I'm talking about. That we have become so graphics-addicted is proly part of our social/genetic problem.... jmo, tho.... lol
My haas controller is much more of an issue, tho. :)
--
EA


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I may have fired it up a few times, but don't recall anything past that.
I actually liked MS works 2.0c for DOS for creating documents with no fuss.
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On Tuesday, March 26, 2013 6:43:04 PM UTC, Cydrome Leader wrote:

Well, you had that on Macintosh since 1984, before Windows. But MS gave away for free early versions on Windows to gain market share. All the proper printing and graphic editing in the early 90s was done on Macintosh.
And before that piece of shit Win95 was released there was a proper OS for PC called OS/2. It had native networking support and it could run multiple sessions of Windows in parallel or Windows programs without Windows. MS sabotaged it.
So don't jump when you hear fucknWindows ...
DanP
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Microsoft destroyed a number of fine programs, and continues to dumb down the public, pyooter-wise. Windows 7 now won't even dignify you with a decent tree directory. That anti-trust bullshit against MS was a joke. Gates is, it appears, a hi-IQ'd carpetbagger. Fuck him and his bullshit Foundation.
--
EA


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On 26/03/13 18:43, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The early 16bit Windows use of true type fonts meant that the WYSIWYG wasn't great as the font information was reduced from Apples, who MS bought it off, 32bit fixed point implementation down to 16bit fixed point. Mind you generally better than what came before on a MS platform.
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wrote:

I recall the third party font stuff you could install on windows 3. I forgot the name, but I still have one laying around somewhere.
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I would be surprised if there aren't quite a few people with Haas experience around. I haven't been on one in a while, but I think it's a user friendly control. Any specific questions?
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On Tuesday, March 26, 2013 8:54:52 AM UTC-7, Existential Angst wrote:

Fire away, I will answer all I have time to. I wont argue about who has a longer keystroke, iff'n ye kno what I mean, but will try to answer questions to the best of my 19 years of working with them
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Bless you.
I proly don't know enough yet to know what I don't know, but let me run tonite's trial by you.
So many g-d screens, it's hard to know whazzup. But I wrote a shitty little program -- which alarmed all over the g-d place until I realized that the spindle actually moves in MINUS X and MINUS Y!!!!!! Holy shit.... I think there's a setting to change that, but no biggie.
Next, for some reason, the control insists on "FNC files" saved as Oxxxxx.NC files, and goddamm notepad/wordpad save everything to xxxx.TXT, even if I put a dot NC in the save-as file name. So I found an online text editor that would allow me to save just Oxxxx.NC.
Now, the manual went to some length to stress how neat it was to have .TXT files, and I assumed it would load my program HAASTEST.TXT, but I had to jump thru hoops to save it as the O-word xxxxx.NC -- not even HaasTest.NC.
So I guess my first big Q is: How to get the control to read plain ole Abcde.txt files.
Then I got "disconnect errors" from pulling the thumb drive in/out, as I edited the file on another pyooter. OK, I RESET out of that.
OK, so I finally got the program to run, with no tools (cuz, well, I got no Haas tooling/knobs yet), but I had a tool change in the program anyway, as I figgered it would do just like the Fadal, and just grab/release air, as if it had a tool
Well, two errors popped up. A tool-not-releasing error, AND a jammed-carousel message, as the carousel never pulled back from the spindle. I read somewhere there's a procedure carousel problems but I have to find it again. So I shut down the machine as was, will call Haas tomorrow.
I will be disappointed if the machine alarms out just cuz there's no tool in a pocket.
The machine is not yet signed off on yet, and I suspect it might be a while. It turns out that the umbrella carousel was the bulk of a day's installation, as it was shipped in a reverse configuration, to save shipping footprint (21 tool). There were a fair amount of problems in this install, as you are supposed to do this via a hoist, but three of us (me, my bud, and the haas tech) humped it into place, not entirely free of dings, etc. In fact, the axle got seriously stuck, and had to be pressed out with a threaded rod/coupling not doodad I fabbed up for the tech. The point being, I don't know if this has anything to do with today's jam. The tech had tested the carousel for 1 tool change last week, but that was it.
Seems to be a lot more hoops you gotta jump thru compared to the Fadal, but 'tis what 'tis. I'm glad to have the gantry system, and hope the bugs work themselves out without too much drama.
--
EA



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Well, well, well, now I gotta go get me a new machine, and, wouldn't ya know it, as soon as I volonteer my limited k nowledge, I end up with egg in my stew!!
New control, none of what you described is familiar, so, to school I go! And, I can't help you with physical damage and such. keep asking though.
"D"
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No pro'leng, this is really HAAS's problem, bein as it is a brand new machine. I got the tool changer thingy fixed over the phone, learned some about finagling the control in the process.
Apparently the control does require a dot NC file extension, which makes fuiknWordpad et al near-useless, with that automatic TXT stuff. 'tis what 'tis, mebbe I can change some default or sumpn.
I must say, tho, that altho the Fadal 88HS controller is less fancy, it is much more straightforward, "ergonomic". Once I get a usb thumbdrive on the fadal, it'll be even better.
Not saying I'm capable of making a "fair" comparison yet. After a few months of actually operating the haas control, I'll be able to make more objective assessments, but at first blush, it seems bells and whistles can actually make life a little more arduous. We'll see what happens.
Overall, tho, the GR510 is a thrilling machine -- not super-fast (the old umbrella carousel), not 5 axis/15 dimension, not super powerful (a 5 hp Baldor on the spindle -- a bit shy of the advertised 15 hp.... lol ) but one big honking work envelope, 5 FEET by 10 FEET!! Essentially the equivalent of *fifteen* 16x30 Fadals.
But both have their place. Small stuff on the Fadal, big long stuff on the Haas. I've already been approached with 4 jobs for the machine, and it just arrived on Tues, 3/12.... holy shit....
--
EA

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I have not ever had any problems with txt files. If you really do need to use .nc on the latest control it's easy enough to just rename a text file with a .nc extension and then set your computer to associate it with notepad. I generally don't use wordpad since there are occasions where formatting will mess you up.
"I had to jump thru hoops to save it as the O-word xxxxx.NC -- not even HaasTest.NC." The O word should be in the first block after the first percent sign. It's not included in the file name.
As for FNC, you may have something set to look for that. Unfortunately I don't have current access to a recent control. One thing I would check is your program list. If it's in the wrong tab, hit cancel to back up to the tabs and arrow to the regular programs. Sorry I don't know offhand what the name is, but it would be the tab on the left. The other tabs would indicate FNC and USB.
You mentioned tool changer recovery. There's a button for that, but I never used it since I already knew how to recover from various situations. I apologize for being somewhat vague, but I'm not at work and can't look at a control - not to mention not the fact that I'm not even currently running a Haas. It would be very easy to show you around the control if I happened to be standing next to you. I think you'll like it after you spend some time running the machine.
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I have not ever had any problems with txt files. If you really do need to use .nc on the latest control it's easy enough to just rename a text file with a .nc extension and then set your computer to associate it with notepad. I generally don't use wordpad since there are occasions where formatting will mess you up.
"I had to jump thru hoops to save it as the O-word xxxxx.NC -- not even HaasTest.NC." The O word should be in the first block after the first percent sign. It's not included in the file name. ====================================================It apparently is in this FNC silliness -- I was on the phone with Haas today, who walked me thru a couple of things -- the file name itself needs the O word.... unbelievable. Assuming they're correct, of course.... lol
But I think you're right, FNC is associated with USB, and if I can get programs straight into machine memory, TXT might be OK. Funny how that works.
They're sending their Haas programming wizard tomorrow, to give me some training -- heh, I don't know if one session will suffice, or what the training "syllabus" is. One thing is f'sure.... if I wadn't already experienced in the fadal, NONE of what haas is doing now would be sufficient. I was expecting classroom-type situations at the Haas dealership -- sheeit, they have enough conference rooms over there!
But we'll see what happens. I'm learning that there is real economic pushing and shoving between CorPirate Haas and the dealers/HFOs themselves, some of it fairly adversairial, ALWAYS along the lines of Who pays for What, Who screwed up What, Who's responsible for What.... A real blame game. In which even the techs get caught up in this bullshit. My setup tech musta cajoled me half a dozen times to tell the boss he did a good job!!!!!
And really, he didn't, not because he wadn't a good competent tech, but because Haas left him flapping in the wind!!! AND it was his first GR510 install!
So, being a union schlep myself, quite familiar with the Bureaucratic Blame Game, I mostly keep my mouth shut, cuz I don't know who's going to suffer as a result. If things absolutely are not going to work out, then I'll start yapping, but I'll let shit muddle along for the time being.
Afaict, neither notepad nor explorer let you change file extensions. Or at least I can't do it. You can rename the file, but not the extension. What a fukn pita.
So I downloaded Notepad++, which has much more file-handling capabilities, and even there it took a while to figger out how to save an explicit extension -- or no extension! I'll save the file as O11124.NC, with All files (*.*) in the dialogue box -- only then does it not add a pre-selected extension. Regular fuknNotepad, if you save the file as O11124.NC, winds up saving it as O11124.NC.TXT !
Hopefully all this will be moot after tomorrow. Overall, the machine has treeee-mendous potential. I'm still dizzy over the prospect of being able to lay down 10 FOOT long material, punching a button, and coming back when it's done. I'm sure many here know what's it like doing that in 3016-sized machine, with the side doors off -- a royal pita, AND messy!!
I've designed what is essentially a "universal holding system" for long and/or flat material, using a system of disposable "rails" drilled/tapped every inch in Y, one rail every foot in X -- almost MiteeBite-ish in rationale, but really not rocket science. It basically will allow me to readily utilize 10 foot long fixed and movable vise jaws. Not for .0001 accuracy, but waaaay good enough for what I'm doing. With just a little care, I could proly hold .001-.005 or so over 10 feet -- not bad, really.
Or so I think..... LOL
--
EA





As for FNC, you may have something set to look for that.
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"It apparently is in this FNC silliness -- I was on the phone with Haas today, who walked me thru a couple of things -- the file name itself needs the O word" There was no reason for that file naming convention on the latest control I used, which I believe was built last year. I've run files with .txt, .nc, and .tap extensions. The file contents are: % O1 (or whatever your program number will be) whatever code you want to run %
How big are the programs you're running? If you're not doing a lot of surfacing, you should stick to running from memory. You only need FNC for long files (assuming that you don't want to drip feed from a DNC connection.)
"if I can get programs straight into machine memory" If you are transferring from USB, simply select the file, press F2 and send it to memory.
"I don't know if one session will suffice" One day should be more than enough. You don't need classroom training.
"Afaict, neither notepad nor explorer let you change file extensions." All you need to do is change the extensions inside Windows Explorer. Simply select your file and rename with either F2 or a right click and then rename. I'm assuming that you have Windows set to show extensions. (And assuming that you're using Windows). After you rename the extension, right click the file and choose "Open With", and then associate the file type with Notepad.
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"It apparently is in this FNC silliness -- I was on the phone with Haas today, who walked me thru a couple of things -- the file name itself needs the O word" There was no reason for that file naming convention on the latest control I used, which I believe was built last year. I've run files with .txt, .nc, and .tap extensions. The file contents are: % O1 (or whatever your program number will be) whatever code you want to run %
How big are the programs you're running? If you're not doing a lot of surfacing, you should stick to running from memory. You only need FNC for long files (assuming that you don't want to drip feed from a DNC connection.)
"if I can get programs straight into machine memory" If you are transferring from USB, simply select the file, press F2 and send it to memory.
"I don't know if one session will suffice" One day should be more than enough. You don't need classroom training.
"Afaict, neither notepad nor explorer let you change file extensions." All you need to do is change the extensions inside Windows Explorer. Simply select your file and rename with either F2 or a right click and then rename. I'm assuming that you have Windows set to show extensions. (And assuming that you're using Windows). After you rename the extension, right click the file and choose "Open With", and then associate the file type with Notepad. ======================================================= Re the Haas controller: you are largely correct. The root cause of most of my problems was that the Fadal saved it's programs with line numbers, including an N1 before the opening O-word and pgm identifier, which the Haas then rejects. Now I don't have any problems.... or fewer problems.... :)
But altho explorer et al will let you change file names, I still can't get the extension to change -- altho that is moot now, and if it is ever an issue NotePad++ will do it.
But try to change the extension in Explorer or whatever, and then look at the file in a true ascii text editor -- or dir in DOS -- and you'll proly see that you didn't get what you thought you would -- OR that you ADDED a TXT to the existing extension or sumpn. If you CAN truly change the extension, let me know how you did it! I miss DOS..... :(
The Haas training guy was very very good, an experienced machinist as well, nice guy. Problem is, the Haas controller just as so many LAYERS!!! But pretty versatile, it seems. The Renishaw probe is ossum.
Still have a ways to go. NJ Haas has some insight into the learning process, they know that even a full day of training is too much, so they do it in pieces, to give you time to digest the prior training. A lot to digest, indeed, and that's with me already knowing g-code, macros, the Fadal, etc. Someone coming in cold turkey is gonna need plenty of Advil. Sheeit, *I* need Advil!! My buddy taking the training with me needed cold compresses on his forehead.... lol
--
EA



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On Friday, March 29, 2013 10:07:48 AM UTC-7, Existential Angst wrote:

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I'm on Windows 7. If your file extensions aren't visible, you need to open Windows Explorer, click on Organize, then click on Folder and Search optio ns. Select the View tab. Uncheck "Hide extensions for known file types". That will allow you to see the file extensions. Then it's as easy as rena ming the file extension. Of course Windows will give you a warning when yo u do so. Then associate the file with Notepad so that type of file will al ways open with it. But I still say there's no reason why a .txt file won't work.
The control is very simple and user friendly. You should have the basics b y now and you can learn additional things as you go along.
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On 29/03/2013 17:07, Existential Angst wrote:

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-vista/show-or-hide-file-name-extensions
You can do it in explorer.
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