On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 03:46:28 GMT, "Don Kelly" Gave us:
Two key words. CORE, and THROUGH. That counts as one turn (loop). The core counts as the medium through which the transference occurs.
His little metal bits in epoxy do not count as a core, and parallel wires can inject microvolt amplitudes from one to the other, but passing power? No.
On 19 Jul 2006 21:43:07 -0700, "Ken S. Tucker" Gave us:
What the *bleep* do we know anyway? (good movie).
On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 05:03:56 GMT, "The Real Chris" Gave us:
You're an idiot. Magnetic flux "travels" in the core and couples the energy from one winding to the other. No stinking photons required. We don' need no stinking photons in our REAL WORLD transformers!
Next thing ya know, you'll be tellin' us that dark matter, and dark photons do the work.
Here's a hint.... wire + current flow = magnetic flux.
It has been proven, and has worked for several decades, totaling well over a century!
On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 05:03:56 GMT, "The Real Chris" Gave us:
You don't even know elementary spelling.
I'd bet that you wear your pants down past your asscrack too.
Pants?
On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 20:38:23 -0500, Bill Snyder Gave us:
Haven't you seen all these "modern" adolescent twit kids running around these days with their pant hanging down past their ass?
It's the "in thing" nowadays. Personally, I think it is so Suzy Sleesytwit and Johnny Jiztard can feel each other up easier.
You got young kids?
I meant, what makes you think this loon wears any?
On Thu, 20 Jul 2006 21:21:08 -0500, Bill Snyder Gave us:
Ahhh... The Emperor... The blind shall not see...
I fart in their DIRECT direction!
Ethel! You get yer clothes on!
Hee hee Before you jump on me for bottom/top/side/whatever posting just wanted to say that was a pretty good snide remark. made me chuckle. Keep up the good work floyd. "I only need this lamp, and thats all I need."
----------- First of all, it IS a transformer. For your information, there are distribution transformers built with glass ferrite cores -essentially a well designed version of what Chris has mentioned. These are quite satisfactory and have some advantages in terms of core losses. Secondly, many a lineman has been killed when he closed a secondary "microvolt" " loop. Put 1KV on the primary, with the secondary open, so that 1 million microvolts can appear on the secondary-even without a ferromagnetic core. Do you know why there will be a high current in that case? You are correct on one thing- a straight through wire counts as a turn. All is not lost.
Nobody, has suggested that this transformer is a good one. It may not be but not for the reasons that you present.
"Ken S. Tucker" wrote in message news: snipped-for-privacy@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
I admit the analogy was badly crippled-I haven't one that isn't. However, I do not have the same concern with regard to "relative" that you have. I do see what you are getting at and -yes- if one's velocity is the same as that of the moving charge- then one cannot observe the motion or effects of the motion and will not see a magnetic field. In that case, all one sees is an electrostatic field. fair enough. Does that make a magnetic field "imaginary" ? Possibly what is "real" depends on ones reference frame but we all work within our own reference frame which is rarely that of a moving charge (instantaneous velocity=??or a particle with 0 rest mass, momentum, and evanescent existence- possibly as a wave existing everywhere at once). An alternator (you know by now that my background is in machines and power- not electronics) is analysed on a reference frame that is rotating and the results can be tranformed to a stationary reference frame -in terms of what can be measured from outside without getting dizzy. Is this real? I think so. However there may be many aspects of reality- Kron dealt with this using tensor analysis and I once read a delightful and poetic book on relativity which also used tensor analysis. Photo electric effect, Millikan, quantum effects in semiconductors, tunnel diodes, etc. do support "quantum" ideas which are more basic than continuum ideas. However, where do the lines blur? I would suggest, as have others, that for the majority of situations, as has been indicated by others, that most protons, virtual or otherwise are low energy and classical methods work just as well. Going back to a previous rhetorical question, one could use full blown EM theory to solve a circuit problem-getting the same result, with much more work, than using circuit theory which is a quasi-static approximation. Continuum models may be a "quasi-static" approximation in the case of multiple particle interactions at multiple individual energy levels-resulting is a statistical blur with an immeasurable standard deviation- i.e. reduced to a deterministic model. Heisenberg uncertainty covers a lot of evils for an individual particle (even the direction of force involved with a virtual photon). Quantisation exists but we have no way that we can actually make use of this on a gross level.
The problem with an inductor or transformer is that we are in this multi-particle, multi-energy situation. We could, in theory, come up with a multidimension model requiring, at least, an nxn matrix where n is in the order of quadrillions+. Now replace this with the result: "B" Convenient, very much so. Real? Apparently physics, even quantum physics, treats it as such. Does it go away if no-one is looking -after all, isn't that implicit in quantum mechanics (heisenberg)?
Anyhow, have fun and always ask "why?"
I'm not clever enough to answer.
On 22 Jul 2006 11:43:08 -0700, "Ken S. Tucker" Gave us:
You're too tense.
We don't know if the field has any independent existance as the only way we detect it is in its effect on a moving charge. Inability to detect is not proof of non-existence. I also note that the force between two charges moving at the same velocity (parallel) does produce a force which is not just that due to Coulomb force. In any case the magnetic field concept is too useful to throw out. I think younger minds than mine will have to deal with this. I am in the stage where my understanding of physics is decreasing at a rate greater than that which can be accounted for by growth in the area.:)
Hello,
Does that poster know what a "Tensor" is? We did tensor calculations (calculus) when we did crystal physics. The permitivity tensor is used when the permitivity is dependant on the direction. Its use is to calculate such things as the velocity of light in different directions with respect to the crystal axis.It is in effect just a matrix. There are also Matrixes that can be visualised as a cube containg numbers is a three - d array or with higher dimentionality.
They are represented by indicies Tijkl is a tensor with ... well to draw it would require hyerspace. Those symbols were called the Christoffel symbols because I'm Chris. They can be arrays of differentials if you are calculating differential equations. Best use a virtual machine like MathCad.
I don't really understand these thing now because my doctor said I was mad and took the maths processor out of me brain because the silly shrink had not heard of them (of course not - shrinks don't know anything)
The metric tensor is the same, it says that as you try to move in different directions in space where there are massive objects the length of space varies. In this way you can use fermats principle of least time to calculate your trajectory through this area, like a globular cluster. The general metric will include both special and general relativity.
However brain removal to make me normal has succeded. I no longer understand anything.
Thank you. The fine for brain reduction is one billion pounds per ml. I want me brain back.
Chris.
I said I no longer understand it.
On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 16:00:12 GMT, "The Real Chris" Gave us:
would require hyerspace. Those symbols were called the Christoffel symbols because I'm Chris.
No... you are Christawful. The only symbols you come up with are christawful symbols.
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