Armstrong Tools phasing in and out?

According to Martin H. Eastburn :

Well ... there are tapered gibs, which is why I did not originally make a distinction between the Aloris sliding wedge and the undersized gib which sticks out from the center of the rear dovetail side on the Dorians. Personally, I think that the Aloris design is a bit more solid that the Dorian -- but both are so much better than the piston style (which Aloris makes some of as well, but does not push. :-))

And I have the Series 200 (BXA size) Phase-II toolpost, with a mix of Aloris and Phase-II holders -- with no problem using them all on the same toolpost.

:-)

Enjoy, DoN.

According to Louis Ohland :

They even have some significant misspellings in there. For example in the "tool holders" I find (at the bottom):

====================================================================== Reversible Yolk Boring Tool Holders ======================================================================

(They have it right (yoke) in the link, but wrong in the big blue-background header. :-)

It worked for me -- but no sign of any quick-change toolposts and holders. :-)

But I'm pretty sure that I *have* seen some in the MSC catalog some years back. I wonder how long since that web site has actually been updated?

Enjoy, DoN.

Top picture the KBC one is a piston type - see the rectangle with black hole for a screw? That is the piston.

Mart>

I can't get the web site to show me the images (it may be designed to only work with Outlook Explorer), but the black circle inside a rectangle is typical of the piston style. A wedge looks more like this (view with a fixed pitch font to avoid distortion):

+--------------- Wedge -- moves up and down, and left | to right ght at the same time -- widening | the dovetail in the process. V +-----+--------+-----+ | | \###| | | | ###| | | | \##| | | | ##| | | | \#| | | | #| | | | \| | +-----+--------+-----+

except that I can't draw the diagonal line cleanly with ASCII graphics, because the slashes are too large an angle.

The black circle inside a rectangle moves straight in and out to push on the center of the female dovetail on the holders. Both the rectangle and the circle move together. The circle is a flathead screw holding the rectangle to the piston inside the post.

Enjoy, DoN.

We must be having terminology confusion here.

Piston - round shaft that jams into tool holder wedge - double dovetail that pulls toolholder onto post gib - one of the dovetail sides is moveable, and acts like a gib

Your illustration is what I'd refer to as a gib.

The KBC QC toolpost is a wedge

The Armstrong QC toolpost is a gib

Alles klar, her kommisar?

D> Accord>>> Top picture the KBC one is a piston type - see the rectangle with black

I believe a wedge by design is a chunk with an angle on it.

The piston type push the holder away from the post and the dovetails mate.

I have the Aloris and the wedge moves to actuate and lock in the tool. Martin

Mart> Pardon me, but isn't that black circle inside a rectangle, and therefor

Louis - I believe you have a handle on descriptions but a piston can be any shape that pushes away. Cars and air conditioners use round pistons. The pressure plate on the push rod in this case is a rectangular shape that mates with the tool holder dovetail center for equal and lateral force.

face on view

Armstrong aloris

Mart> We must be having terminology confusion here.

Louis, the QCTPs I've used are the generic and Phase II types.

Piston types have a rigid/fixed-size dovetail, and the piston (located in the center of the post's dovetail with a rectangular pad attached to it) pushes outward on the toolholder to hold the tool's height position. The piston jams the toolholder's dovetail surfaces against the angled post's dovetail surfaces. I've seen pictures of mini lathe QCTPs where the piston is round, but the bigger piston types I've seen have all had a rectangular pad attached to the piston to increase the surface area of the piston.

Wedge types have a variable-width dovetail, in that the locking wedge is tapered, and slides/moves vertically, changing the width of the dovetail. The toolholder is pulled inward/toward/onto the toolpost as it is tightened into position. The wedge types are generally considered to have better gripping/holding force, and this is sometimes believed to be capable of more accurate positioning of the cutting tool. Some (most?) users claim that the wedge type is a more rigid tool mounting system, others comment that the 2 types are about the same in performance.

I haven't seen a Dorian gib type, and hadn't heard of this type of QCTP, prior to this thread.

I foolishly purchased a HF (39083 100/AXA series) piston type QCTP years ago (made in India) that was essentially a nightmare to fix and use. The number of problems is a long list.

I've since then purchased both the Phase II piston and wedge type QCTP sets, and they are both much better than the HF, in quality, fit and finish (as in comparing night and day). I haven't measured the individual toolholder dovetails, but they are all closely matched in size, and all of the holders are interchangeable between the 2 posts.

WB ......... metalworking projects