Differentiated thought update

Now get busy, and put the Chinese out of the wire brush business! :)

Most all of the products that were our bread and butter...and a nice portion of jam, are made in China now so we had to develop niche products that are too few or too difficult for the Chinese to make. Wal-Mart buys a shoe-handle model wire scratch brush for 19 cents delivered, that they sell for 99 cents. It costs me 25 cents to buy the wire in coils that have to be cut yet. Hard to compete even though mine would out-last the China model by ten to one. The consumer doesn't care.

There's a good article in a recent New Yorker about where intuition comes from which might be a helpful read. Hard science, not hand-waving psycho-babble.

On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 01:22:54 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, "Tom Gardner" quickly quoth:

The consumer DOES care. I purchased a set of 6 wire brushes from HF a couple months ago. I used one last week and all the wires (steel) bent over on the first pass or three. Their brass BBQ brush died on the third use, but the scotchbrite pad on the other side is holding in there all this year.

I need to get up a small list for you, Tawm.

-- Who is wise? He that learns from every One. Who is powerful? He that governs his Passions. Who is rich? He that is content. Who is that? Nobody. -- Benjamin Franklin

Can you summarize it for us?

Some customers would care, if they had any idea. Quality, domestic made products have been gone for so long that they have no clue. :(

As the wages and operating costs go up in China, it will cause some of that work to return to our shores. Like the sign said, "You are the top dog, and your competitors are all fire hydrants!!!" ;-)

It's too bad I didn't know about you or your business, when I lived in Ohio. I was 'up north' a few times a year.

BTW, have you ever visited Mendelson's in Dayton Ohio? It's a huge industrial surplus business. I used to visit quite often, and buy bulk hardware by the pound. They had over 1000 new & used motors, along with anything removed when a factory was shut down, or retooled. I bought a

5/8-27 tap there for $1.25. My boss was pissed, because the company had pad almost $300 for the same tap, through their normal supply system.

They also had an area for industrial customers only.

Let me rephrase, the consumer doesn't even have access to quality anymore. None of my scratch brushes are available to the public anymore, only industrial/professional.

Tom,

Aye, there's the rub! I always look for Canadian / USA made stuff first but nowadays there is little choice. Even my wife is beginning to complain about the lack of choices not just in one store but between stores.

I am convinced that people, given a choice between low price low quality goods vs good quality fair priced goods would evaluate this at least subconsciously and make the appropriate decision. Sometimes it may indeed be in favour of low-cost low price, eg. brushes to clean machinery. But a wire brush in regular workshop usage would warrant a good quality purchase.

And, thanks for the compliment. I hope you can put some of the info given to good use. Your Op sounds like a fun place. I was running a small automation outfit 10 or so years ago (until sold by the owner) and it was a fun place to work. Lots of creativity and elegant solutions. The new owners ran it into bankruptcy!

Wolfgang

snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com wrote in news:5259520b-3885-439c-9659-9b4cbba23dcd@

2g2000hsn.googlegroups.com:

Most seem to be members of the "Throwaway Society" - get it cheap, use it only a few times for a specific job, then throw it away in the full knowledge that, soon enough, they'll have to get another one, use it a few times, then throw it away.

They also view people the same way.

If it's something that I don't already have on hand, unlikely to ever be needed once a specific project is completed, and I'm not that sure that I'd be using it properly then I'll go cheap.

OTOH, If I have to replace it, I >WON'T< go cheap since, having determined a need for [and learned the proper use of] a good one, I'll >get< a good one.

For the most part, I consider the cheap ones to be expendable supplies rather than >tools

the rotary brushes I get sure don't last long. I wish I could get better quality ones. I use a rotary brush in a 1/4 inch shaft in an air tool to clean up the internal threads on castings when they come back from heat treating. The minor diameter of the acme threads range from three inchs and larger. I must have gone through over 20 of them in the last six months.

Got any suggestions?

John

On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 13:50:44 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, "Tom Gardner" quickly quoth:

Are you saying that you can or will no longer sell to us, Tawm? Or are you saying that what we seek isn't on the US consumer market any longer?

-- Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life. ---- --Unknown

Air tools spin too fast for most brushing operations. At 10-20k they burnish rather than cut. Also, there's not much wire in those little brushes. I'm surprised you only go through 20, I have customers that go through more in a day. How about a 8" dia. 2" wide wire wheel on a body grinder? The variables are: Speed, pressure, diameter, wire diameter, trim length, wire alloy, width and horsepower. When you find the right mix, the job is done well for the least cost.

Ace Hardware used to carry our stuff they bought through a distributor. Western Auto bought truckloads when I was a kid. Gone! The consumer market only has Osborn brushes left for the better quality, available at Home Depot, and those brushes are made in Mexico. I can't figure out how to sell to the public. Brushes are so cheap that

We sold an Index G200 that was fully amortized though it had mainenance issues because the parts it was making could be bought from Korea for less than the price of American raw materials. Sucks for a hard working American to be told his or her job went away because no matter how hard you work, you will still cost more.

Wes

Larry Jaques wrote: ...

I've heard it attributed to Art Blakey. Slightly different: "Music washes away the dust of everyday life."

When CP still made good air tools in Utica, they sold a die grinder that had a gear reduction drive on it. It turned 4-5k instead of the high speed. About the only thing I have seen like it sold today is the one IR sells as a tire buffer (IR-327LS). That one is high torque but lower rpm (3k). I would bet it would work good with a wire wheel.

Actually, that's too slow. Run a brush at it's optimum "surface feet per minute".

Chances are foreign governments subsidize some industries. We used to make millions of 1/4" stem mounted hardware quality brushes. The Spanish prison system make them with rejected tire-cord wire. That's the brass-plated wire you see everywhere, it's crap.

On Sat, 6 Sep 2008 20:05:38 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, "Tom Gardner" quickly quoth:

Man, either your accountant is way overpaid or your documentation level exceeds that of the _IRS_ on a bad day.

You'll just have to "lose stock" "scrap stock" off the production floor sometime soon, huh? I wouldn't want you to get into trouble over paperwork. ;)

Alternatively, I could stock your brushes here in Oregon for consumer distribution. Send a 30' container full.

-- Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life. ---- --Unknown