Hydraulics help please

wrote:


And just like that I found another use for hydraulic power. The front hyd. cylider only raises the front blade. It is single acting and cannot be made double acting because of the way the cylinder is built into the casting with the raising mechanism. But I can add another cyl. to push the arms down. So I think I'm gonna get a two spool joystick control so I can force the blade down rather than letting gravity do the work. I do need to learn about the open center floating spool with detent type valve because all the joystick controls I have seen so far are made with one of the spools being this type. If I go this route I will need to remove the front hyd. cyl. from the Honda hyd. circuit. Eric
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On Mon, 01 Oct 2018 09:49:22 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@whidbey.com wrote:

Another, simpler solution if it's just a little 4 foot or smaller plow on a Garden Tractor is a winch/windlass system or a worm gear/linear actuator setup. Much simpler and lower cost. An ATV winch can be bought for under $100, with the reversing switch on a "pigtail" - Mount the winch virtical with short cable running from side to side of the blade, with several wrapps around the winch drum. Put a heavy tension spring on one side or both.
Linear actuators are a bit more expensive and less robust.
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wrote:

They're the upgrade (instead of a winch) for this type of plow. https://www.snowbear.com/builder/plows--medium-duty-trucks-84-straight-blade.htm?sbp_vehicleTypeID ­2DB0BF-D9F8-904A-3081-B404BB1D78B1&sbp_plowTypeIDÁ95BA8A-FD93-D004-48BC-CE5C91E1B315&action=lift&thisChain=Plows%20%3E%20Medium%20Duty%20Trucks%2084%22%20Straight%20Blade
A friend used one for the bucket lock on his skid steer. Plenty robust for that job as well, but slow. He said he hits the button the day before he wants to swap implements.
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On Mon, 01 Oct 2018 13:46:13 -0700, Winston Smith

Fine for a lift - not so good for power angle.

A week earlier might work better - - - - - Nothing beats hydraulics for functionality
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wrote:

Assuming the pivot and guide rail are lightly lubed, one should be able to swing that little blade with tug on some fishing line, or maybe even a few shots with a Red Ryder BB gun. Mounting a $100 actuator flexibly to guarantee the lock pin is taking the load would do the job.

My old skidsteer had a homebrewed hydraulic quick attach. Press the pedal and the pins seemed like they wanted to be punch presses when they grow up. Overkill for sure, but very fast. My new one has an electric linear actuator that takes about 6 seconds. A bit of a downgrade but this one isn't hogging an aux port or requiring a mile of hose and tubing and fittings and an extra valve.
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Ok then why use Cylinders in the first place. Just raise rotate and pin. If you don't want to move it on the move then just forget everything and use a pin. If you are pushing a load with the blade, and you only have a Cylinder it needs to be as large as you risk the tractor.
I don't get the unpin - turn the blade in an arc then pin and drive. You have to get off the tractor at least once. Martin
On 9/30/2018 4:46 PM, snipped-for-privacy@whidbey.com wrote:

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On Sun, 30 Sep 2018 21:59:31 -0500, Martin Eastburn

Power steering pumps "generally" turn at close to crankshaft speed, as the pulley on the pump is close to, but slightly smaller than, the same size as the crank pulley. On your "average" V6 or V8 that redlines somewhere north of 4500 RPM (and some WELL north of that figure) the pump will definitely be turning above 3600 RPM fairly often. Maximum flow and pressure ratings are often given at 5000 shaft RPM A GM Vickers style vane pump runs about 2 gallons per minute ans 1250-1400psi in normal PS use and can apparently go as high as 9GPM at higher speeds.
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On Sun, 30 Sep 2018 21:59:31 -0500, Martin Eastburn

You're not getting it Martin. The whole reason is so I don't have to get off the tractor like I do now. I even said that in my first post. Just look above in the first paragraph. The last sentence. Eric
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If you are concerned about contaminating the Honda's hydraulic fluid you could put a filter like this in your return line. They are smaller than spin-on filters and can be installed in the line without a support bracket. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bobcat-Skid-Steer-Hydraulic-Case-Drain-Filter-Assembly-S175-S185-S205-/322395136825
http://info.texasfinaldrive.com/shop-talk-blog/why-case-drain-filters-are-so-important
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On Sun, 30 Sep 2018 10:57:29 -0400, Fake Gunner forged:

That's true.
At idle with the steering wheel static, a typical power steering pump holds about 80 to 125 psi in the output line. Yank the steering wheel a couple of times in rapid succession -- causing the pressure-release valve to flutter open and shut -- and a typical modern pump might momentarily put between 1,000 and 1,500 psi through the lines. Older and lower-performing pumps might run 850 psi of momentary pressure or less, while heavy-duty off-road pumps may sustain 1,600 or more. High-performance pumps can jump to 2,500 psi before the valve releases. and hold upward of 8,000 to 10,000 psi internally before bursting.
But that's nothing compared to the sucking power Rudy and his pal Fake Gunner can produce, once they get on their knees and get down to business.
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Does it have a seat safety? On my little Yanmar/Deere 4wd tractor if I get off the seat it kills the PTO. It may not be an issue for a blade, but it would certainly be an issue for my bucket loader. There have been plenty of times I needed to raise, adjust, or dump the bucket when standing beside the tractor. Of course for me your application would be easier. I'd just connect the hydraulics to the quick disconnect from the bucket when I pulled it off. I also do not have a front PTO. Just rear.
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wrote:

Yeah, it does have a seat safety. Just another reason to add hydraulics to swivel the front blade while I'm sitting on the tractor. I would love to use the tractor hydraulics to swivel the blade but it will actually be easier to just add a complete system. And the way the tractor is built it is almost like they expected someone to hang a hydraulic pump off the front PTO. There are a couple really robust castings with pivot holes just in the right place. Easy to get at, about .75 dia and 1 inch long through holes. Eric
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On Mon, 01 Oct 2018 11:27:46 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@whidbey.com wrote:

Yeah, hydraulics are a lot more fun and sexier, but when a simple spring, bracket, throttle-style cable, and reins could do it, why not give those a think?
Spring load the pin via the bracket and spring, with the throttle control coming up to the hood to lift it. Curve a piece of 3/32" wire rope up to the hood from the blade ends. Pull the pin, pull one side of the rope until the pin can drop into the tilted hole and you're done. It wouldn't take you two hours, including parts retrieval.
Hydraulics are too messy with tiny tractors.
--
"I have noticed even people who claim everything is predestined
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Having done it I disagree, though finding components small enough to fit into the cramped spaces was tricky, and I had to make several hydraulic parts including the adjustable pressure regulator, bushings to adapt the cylinder seals I could find to the pistons and the oil-tight welded frame / reservoir. The oil strainer housing is a 2" pipe tee, in the side, out the top, and drain at the bottom.
-jsw
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On Mon, 1 Oct 2018 18:52:25 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"

I guess you like messy. ;)
--
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It ceased being messy after I learned to do things right.
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On Fri, 5 Oct 2018 06:49:02 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"

Messy = overly complicated (to me). Whatever works for ya.
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Hey, I designed and built my first computer and coded its operating system and editor/assembler. By comparison making a hydraulic bucket loader was quick and easy. -jsw
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On Thu, 11 Oct 2018 18:50:38 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"

Har! I guess so. I remember flipping a sequence of toggle switches on the (Altair?) computer to load the bootloader from the 14" hard disc for the old Baird Gamma Camera from the '70s eons ago, so I vaguely grok your design.
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wrote:

It was functionally similar to an Altair or PDP-8. The company was very supportive of my effort to learn computer engineering and programming and gave me the 8080 CPU and some samples of 6116 (2K x 8) CMOS memory that I kept alive with NiCads so I wouldn't have to enter the bootstrap loader each time. A Teletype saved programs on paper tape until I built an FSK modem to store them on a cassette recorder. The I/O ports were similar to an IBM PC's except the video which was a monochrome version of the Radio Shack Color Computer's.
I bought an RSP1A at a hamfest last weekend. https://www.sdrplay.com/ In the 90's at Mitre I built prototypes of software-controlled digital radios like that but always turned them over to the engineers to play with.
The free SDRuno program makes it a universal radio receiver for up to 2 GHz, and it can also be a spectrum analyzer over that range. While it doesn't have the calibrated accuracy, wide scan width or tracking generator output of my HP spectrum analyzer the signal display is good, and looks much better on an HDTV.
On my suggestion the seller set up the demo to receive ADS-B data from nearby aircraft and overlay their locations onto Google Maps as a virtual radar, which had been a 90's Mitre project. ADS-B is at 1090 MHz, weather satellites are at 137 MHz. The aircraft band is 118-136 MHz. The Grants Pass tower is at 122.8 MHz, Cascade Approach is 124.3, and your weather (wx) is at 120.0. .
I bought a 25-1300 MHz discone antenna for it that I haven't set up yet, since I spent yesterday helping a neighbor fix his garage roof. The feed from my 50 foot high TV antenna was good enough to receive an AM broadcast station at 900 KHz.
-jsw
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