OT fuel system anti-freeze

So I'm doing my regular winter maintenance on the rolling stock. Check
anti-freeze, get the cold weather windshield washer fluid in, etc. We have
a stretch of cold for here weather coming up----mid teens to 20's----and it
got me motivated.
Part of the regimen has always been to toss in a jug of fuel system water
remover/anti-freeze. HEET or whatever is on sale.
Recently the powers that be mandated that we run a gas/ethanol blend year
round. Makes the corn farmers happy I guess. If I'm running 10% ethanol,
the fuel system anti-freeze is redundant--correct? AFAIK all the stuff is
is ethanol? Or is there something here that I'm not seeing?
Bill
Reply to
Bill Marrs
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I think its still a good idea, the fuel anti-freeze is typically methanol or isopropyl alcohol, which will get any water out better than ethanol will.
Being topped off (full tank) before a large swing down in temps is always the best preventative measure.
Dave
Reply to
spamTHISbrp
Theoretically the alky is going to pick up water but for some reason gasohol can't be transported over pipelines and the alky is introduced nearer the point of use.
Someone told me that pipelines often pick up water and the alky sucks it up but I've never tracked it down to understand if this is bs or truth. A quick google shows that water often exists in pipelines but I didn't find the reason why.
I toss a can in from time to time, generally the isopropyl for just in case reasons but I've also gone a year or so skipping it. 45 Latitude Michigan.
If your vehical is flex fuel, no worries at all.
Wes
Reply to
Wes
I don't know, but the gas-line anti-freeze stuff we get here is said to be Methyl Hydrate. Is that Ethanol?
Brian Lawson, Bothwell, Ontario.
Reply to
Brian Lawson
I've never
Some of the water leaks into the tanks. They are really hollow cylinders with a floating plug that seals on the edges. There's also now a roof like an umbrella. Before they were required, rain/snow would fill the space above the floating roof.
Some of it was came from the refinery; crude has water in it.
The SOP is the gasoline/Diesel sits in a tank for X days, and the water settles out. Then the operator manually opens the bottom-most valve, the water draw, and observes the water exiting. He stops when he sees products.
The alcohol is added when the gasoline is loaded into trucks; it's not carried by the pipeline at all. Of course, the station's underground tanks may well leak, and there's always condensation...
Reply to
David Lesher
Most gas-line antifreeze is methyl alcohol (methanol).
Some is isopropyl alcohol.
I've never seen ethyl alcohol (ethanol) used, but it would work.
The poison warning usually tells which it is.
Joe Gwinn
Reply to
Joseph Gwinn
Brian,
Ethanol, pure, is made by fermentation and is the active ingredient in booze.
Methanol, methyl hydrate, aka wood alcohol makes you sick or blind at best if ingested.
Not sure what effect isopropyl alcohol has on one's insides; it is typically used in rubbing alcohol for external use only.
Wolfgang
Reply to
wfhabicher
In article , snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com wrote:
Isopropyl alcohol is poisonous.
Of all the alcohols, only ethyl is not poisonous.
Joe Gwinn
Reply to
Joseph Gwinn
Oh ethyl alcohol is poisonous too. its just a matter of dose. Of course, may people actually enjoy a sub-lethal dose
Karl
Reply to
Karl Townsend
We've had 10% since the late 70's. When fuel systems weren't tightly sealed there were issues with cold and low usage vehicles so most folks just got the regular or premium in the winter.
Since I discovered SeaFoam (non-alcohol), I can start the Toyota rat plow truck once a month and use it for the short periods needed in the winter. I used to have to drain the tank in the fall (lots of water in the fuel no matter what the level or the fuel used).
Matt
Reply to
matthew maguire
Just remember the Alky is hygroscopic - it attracts water - so your fuel may be almost water saturated when you buy it. A drop in temperature throws you into "phase separation" territory where the water and alky fall out of the fuel.
Adding MORE alky raises the threshold, allowing the fuel to hold more water before it falls out.
It's a viscous circle though - - -.
Reply to
clare
In the PAST methanol was the standard. Today almost allways Isopropyl. Methanol has a habit of causing "issues" in fuel injected engines.
Reply to
clare
I was told once that between different types of material they will run a plug of water, and the receiving station will pump into a sperate tank and seperate out the fuel from the start and end of the water plug. Sounded bizarre to me, but who knows what strange things work in the world.
Bob La Londe
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Reply to
Bob La Londe
Damn, wonder if weights and measures are checking for water content?
Seems like a chance for the same deal where you buy meat or poultry that is injected with water.
Wes
Reply to
Wes
Any tank that breathes - drawing in cool damp air at night and it 'dews' inside the tank leaving water.
Martin
matthew maguire wrote:
Reply to
Martin H. Eastburn
Density of gas changes with temp - they measure volume. Some adjust twice a year, some once every 3 years.
They got you in your 'under aware'.
Martin
Wes wrote:
injected with
Reply to
Martin H. Eastburn
Horsepocky..
There are some adjacent product mixes you want to avoid -- gasoline to JetA, for example. Usually, that's handled that by not scheduling such cuts. If unavoidable, you swing to the "slop" tank at first sign of the change and stay there until stable in the new.
The slop tank is then slowly injected into furnace fuel as it arrives, lowering the flash temp. from say 120F to 110F.
Other than that; it's not a big issue. No one sane would send water. What happens if there's a power failure and the line stops... at 32F??
If not, what do you do with the contaminated water at the far end?
Yes, I worked on a products pipeline...
Reply to
David Lesher
ANd propelene Glycol is not technically an alcohol, is it? (I looked it up - it IS a diol alcohol It is more like a modified mineral oil and is not ACCUTELY toxic.
Reply to
clare

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