Six versus 12 point sockets

IF (very big if) you could get the right size, and the "hold" on the corners isn't very good>

...lew...

B.B. wrote in article ...

Why would you....

a.) ....heat the fastener to soften it?

b.) ....then use a tool (pipe wrench) that crushes the softened fastener even tighter onto the threads?

You must gall a lot of threads.......

They call them "pipe" wrenches for a reason.

The hot ticket now is "flank drive" 6 points which grip almost exactly like a 12 point.

On Mon, 28 May 2007 08:00:07 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, clare at snyder.on.ca quickly quoth:

I received my Crapsman set from my folks in 1971-2. By 1979, their quality had truly gone into the toilet and I was replacing broken pieces at least once every week, and they were quite often the same pieces I'd just replaced the day/week before. If the regular manager wasn't there, I sometimes had to come back to get the piece warrantied. Most were sockets and ratchets, but I had a few allens, extensions, adapters, and other pieces break, too. I gave my pounds of flesh and gallons of blood to the gods of Crapsman alright.

Last year, my 1/4" drive speed handle broke and Searz said they no longer made it in the same format. The one I had was built with a 1/4" drive socket in the end of the screwdriver handle and I had to get one through NAPA after a month of haggling with Searz. So much for the Crapsman lifetime guarantee.

After my mother's old Coldspot freezer fan died on me, I went to the Searz appliance parts store and paid $34.95 for a $4 fan. I learned then that I never wanted to buy any other appliances or power tools from Searz.

Then the Searz automotive repair shops were taken to court for cheating their customers by not actually installing parts they said they had. 20/20 or some other TV show nailed 'em in video.

Do you see any trends as to lack of quality and amorality in that corporation, boys and girls?

With Searz, like drugs, JUST SAY NO! -----------

------------------------------------------- Crapsman tools are their own punishment

For someone who appeared to make his living with Sears tools, you appeared to be a slow learner. or was it that you were too cheap to move up to better quality?

Tom

At one time Sears was a very good store. Their quality was excellent and the service was just as good. I bought almost everything I needed from Sears, clothing, tools, and appliances. They were the walmart of their time but with better service and quality.

Once the suits took over and put their nose in other operations like real estate, insurance the company took a nosedive and has never recovered. If you needed parts they never had them or said that your unit was obsolete.

The same can be said for a number of companys.

John

That's what I said! (almost)

Snap-On flank drives sockets and especially spanners tend mark up the fastener faces but they don't corner round like 12 points.

If it's GM Europe you are referring to then in every case I've seen they are reversed Torx head aka "E" heads and not 12 point hex.

On Tue, 29 May 2007 06:54:08 +1200, with neither quill nor qualm, Tom quickly quoth:

Yeah, it could look like that, huh? When I graduated from UTI in late '72, the only job I could find in my town was as a lube tech. That didn't stress my tools much. A little less than a year later, a friend convinced me to go to work with him at Southcom, and I was there for the next 4 years or so, until Loral bought them out and things began to be corporatized. Then I went back to wrenching and found that the tools I had weren't of the highest quality, nor was the f****ng warranty when it's needed every day and you have to fight with the employees to get it handled. YMMV

------------------------------------------- Crapsman tools are their own punishment

I might be wrong with the GM (maybe it was KIA/Mazda). But it was this type:

Nick

Carriage bolts are in the same 'buggy'. (land boat) The rounded head has a square on it - to help thread the far end ? and later bite into a round hole. (assume nice Oak). The other end is square for better torque - more metal to grip upon. Slight miss fit and a hex is rounded.

Mart> snip-----

the reason for the 12 point is simple. Look at the progression of fasteners. The earliest were pins, then when they started using threads most nuts had 4 sides. They then went to 6 sided nuts. Which socket can be used on both? A 12 point. Also there are a LOT of engines that use 12 point nuts on the rod caps and the main caps as well. With a 12 point nut you have more surface area for gripping than with a 6 point. Of course if your a general mechanic who works on just about anything. 6 and 12 points are just a start. I have 6, 8, 12 Spline drive, Torx drive, and a few other specialty types as well.

You can buy any part for any Sears appliance from normal appliance parts sources. My experience here in Canada is the prices are very close, and at least until recently, Sears usually had the part in stock. My appliances, up until last month were OLD. The drier is over

30 years old and still working fine - some parts from sears, some from Camco, all very reasonably priced. Just bought the wife a new set of front loaders - not from sears. The new stuff, from ANY manufacturer appears to be more poorly/cheaply made than the old stuff, with more expensive replacement parts.

That would be individual shops - just like Aamco transmission

Buy chinese instead.

On Mon, 28 May 2007 04:53:40 GMT in rec.crafts.metalworking, "Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote,

No, twelve point sockets may sometimes work on them, but the angles are wrong and the sizes are wrong. They don't fit. Eight point sockets are made for square heads.

a) I know how to use a torch.

b) I know how to use a pipe wrench.

I've galled no threads.

Have a nice day.

Agreed-----but you can use a 12 point for a square head, unlike a six point. Best keep the socket dead perpendicular when you do!

Harold

Carl sez:

"> That's because you're doing it all wrong- you should be using 12 point

Good one, Carl ! Love it.

Bob Swinney

12 Pt sockets have a more uniform wall thickness, and are easier to manufacture in the forging process.

Also, How many socket sets can you sell if you include BOTH, at one low price? Wink, wink.

Guys, think $. Make it cheaper and sell a lot of 'em.

Mike

B.B. wrote in article ...

article

Apparently not - especially if you are using a pipe wrench on standard hex fasteners....That's what they make standard open and box-end wrenches and sockets for.