Re: We're going....

You're looking at the wrong end of the horse...

Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD" >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD!

That's just pie in the sky, until that cream pie smacks him in the face. ;)

Alan

All too true. At least it seems Bush wants to get the ball rolling toward a worthy goal. I don't know how anything like this will ever get through Congress because they it's almost totally a partisian vote these days based on which party sponsors the bills.

If Bush is in office, the Democrats will probably kill all efforts, if a Democrat gets elected, the Republicans will probably try to kill off the program. There might be exceptions in states with huge NASA contractors or in the states of the big three NASA facilities.

hmmmm rather than being cynical about it, why not look at a few reasons WHY it can't happen.

only two transport companies so far.

money is never an object. people have done more with less money than this.

people need to quit being armchair beareucrats and start being spacemen.

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The Bush Space Plan is blowing so much smoke out of their ass, they better get a catalytic converter.

HDS

Aloha, Walter Cronkite told me that when I watched men walk on the moon. Walter was sacrosanct. Not even parents could object when Walter said something. A promise was made to a whole generation of little boys watching television, and that promise was not kept. Now, instead of having the moon base and Mars missions that were promissed, we have a fools war in Iraq, homeless people in the streets, and a usurping texan in the white house. (not sure what's worse, the usurper, or it being a texan) Please pardon me if I do not get excited about someone I don't trust giving, vague speeches, about a plan that conveniently does not reach fruition during his administration. (say that long sentence in one breath) This is just a way to gain popularity, and be able to blame the follow on administration when it doesn't happen. The promise needs to be kept, but I have no faith that it will be kept by the current occupant of the white house. Take Care, Larry

Always remember the old gov't addage. A few hunderd billion here, a few hundred billion there and we start talking about REAL money...

And why was that? Because it was a Skunk Works design. Nothing against them for designing aircraft (which they are VERY good at) but they have no clue about spacecraft design. And tell me, a Lithium alloy tank for liquid hydrogen? Does anyone realize how brittile lithium and its alloys get at temperatures approaching that of liquid hydrogen??? In my opinion they should have cancelled it a few years earlier, or went with a different design from the get-go.

Incorrect. The ISS was initially approved in 1984 as an $8 billion project. By 1993, $10 billion had been spent with very little hardware built, and an estimate of $17.4 billion MORE to complete, as of 2001 $26 billion additional to complete. As of 2001, the total estimate to complete exceeded $37 billion, excluding foreign contributions.

Keep in mind NASA's yearly budget for operations (robotic and human) is only about $14 billion...A spit in the ocean considering the budgets of other agencies...

The reason the ISS has overrun so much is because of changing designs, and the need to "Internationalize" it. In addition to STRONG management, NASA also needs GOOD management. The ISS is the epitome of BAD management, with no one center having a lead on the project, no one having clear authority on the design, etc. There is still no "clear" purpose on what ISS is suppossed to do, and this has led to redesign and more cost... Remember the goal of the Apollo program, Man, Moon, Decade (paraphrasing). The goal of ISS has been "keep people in space and it will be done when it's done," not a very good goal to actually finish a project...

Luckily, NASA is finally getting the clue that their management has fallen apart after Apollo, and is looking for outside help to assess them and get them back on their feet (I know a couple of people who have been approached).

If you want to know about GOOD management, and how NASA actually completed the Apollo project, I would suggest two books: "The Secret of Apollo" by Stephen Johonson (basically a history of Systems Management through Apollo) and "Organizational Communication Imperatives: Lessons of the Space Program" by Phillip K. Tompkins (an overview and assesment of Marshall Space Flight Center management from the Apollo/von Braun age and their organizational forgetting up to the Challenger accident). Check your local library...

I believe that if NASA has a specific goal, then it will succeed, assuming the project is properly funded. If a goal is set to establish a Moon base, and a Mars exploration project, I have no doubt that NASA will be able to succeed. Let's just hope they don't want to commercialize half way through like with the shuttle (shudder)...

Mike Gerszewski Univ. of North Dakota Space Studies Graduate Assistant

Yes, you're obviously right. Having Dan Goldin as NASA Administrator during the boom years of the 90's (the Clinton era, remember?) was definitely a much better path for NASA...

David Erbas-White