Switch controls on a very small layout

I would go for the groundthrows. Simple to install, easy to adjust, and a nice hands-on feel when you're switching.

On Sun, 26 Dec 2004 01:32:19 UTC, Mark Schupack wrote: 2000

..

The ground throws would be my first choice. Another option that was used successfully on a layout I operated on was to use tortoise machines with the toggle switch for control on the fascia in front of the turnout. This eliminates the control panel and a lot of wiring. We used a chunk of aluminum angle as the bracket for the toggle switch.

Ground throws, or maybe DPDT slide switches, would be nice, but if I had all the Tortoises needed I'd probably go that way. Without a big control panel, except maybe at each end of the yard.

Ground throws are nice, but in a small switching layout it can sometimes be difficult to reach in to them without damaging any scenery or derailing any cars.

Since Mark has the Tortoises, I'd use them, but with individual toggle switches instead of a control panel. If he didn't have them already, I'd go with the cable to an under-layout DPDT slide switch.

BTW, I saw something once I plan on trying. Switches/cable handles were recessed into the fascia using PVC pipe caps. Looked like a good technique.

I use the Caboose Industries 202's anywhere a turnout can be reached from the aisle. They are extremely easy to install and use.

My primary consideration was the cost and ease of installation, however, if I was in your position and already HAD the tortoise motors, I would have used them.

Don

-- snipped-for-privacy@prodigy.net

I'll throw out another possibility - why not both?

Use a manual throw (not actually connected to the turnout) as a toggle switch for the Tortoises.

That would let you use the contacts on the Tortoises for power routing, signals, etc, while still giving you the "feel" of manually throwing the turnout.

Mike Tennent "IronPenguin"

In article , Mark Schupack wrote, but I won't quote it:

Part of this is a philosophical question. Do you object to "reaching into the scene"? If so, you obviously want to use the Tortoises, with your choice of electrical system. Control panel? Toggles? Pushbuttons? NX control based on routes rather than individual turnouts?

Some of us (you know this!) think controls are the most interesting part of building a model railroad...

Is there a 4th possibility ???

I might be wrong, but I think DCC allows you to throw a switch with the hand held, DCC controller. I am unsure if this requires a Tortoise machine or not. If I am correct either w/ or w/o a Tortoise machine as part of this approach, I plan to explore this option once I actually build a layout and buy into a DCC system. I like the idea of throwing a switch with the hand held, DCC controller, but I certainly don't know if this is what I will ultimately choose w/o actually trying it out first hand.

Good Luck w/ your layout!

Matt

hand held, DCC controller< DCC allows this but some systems and/or controllers/throttles won't. This requires system research. Usually the lower cost entry level systems will not do this but again some will.

I might also add that even though you ~can~ do something, that doesn't always mean that it is a good idea, or even that it works well. I have the capability to throw turnouts with my Digitrax DT400, 300, 100, UT4, UT2 & UT1, but I do not own a single stationary decoder. I discovered through using the "feature" on other's layouts that I dislike it very much. I would much rather use manual turnouts. If I could not use them, for whatever reason, then I would want to use fascia-mounted controls or something similar. If you can follow your train around, manual turnouts are not a problen. Fascia mounted pushbuttons can work just as well also. If you are required, or prefer, to operate from a fixed point, then panel switches on a track diagram work quite well. For my taste, I find it a nuisance to mess around with the handheld unit in order to operate turnouts. I am a big proponent of DCC, but I do not necessarily believe that every single feature is a good one. Stationary decoders I can easily do without. Your Mileage May Vary. See if you can get Greg Procter, and some of the other non-DCC guys in the group to give you some alternate ideas. I think you may end up not liking the stationary decoders. Greg is a prolific poster to the group and is quite ingenious at that sort of thing.

Captain Handbrake

Ype, quick, what is the turnout number for the track to Campbell's Cannery???? Better to have the control for the turnout at the edge of the layout, either as a slide switch mechanically driving the points or a toggle switch controlling a switch motor. In addition, there are the Railway Engineering hi level throws and the Caboose Industry's ground throws, the only version of turnout control that doesn't allow contacts for controlling frog power.

-- Why isn't there an Ozone Hole at the NORTH Pole?

Exactly. That is only one of many reasons I do not like them. So much easier and faster to push a button, pull a lever, or operate a hand throw. DCC is great for controlling the trains, but there are many facets to the gem that do not interest me at all. Turnouts with stationary decoders is one of them.

Captain Handbrake

Yards and ladders are one place for automatic switching even if the rest of the layout is manual. Systems like the Chief (and others) can remember a sequence of switches and throw them together. This works well for the places mentioned.

I use Peco turnouts with attached point motors and switches - I can throw them by hand, by remote pushbutton, or by computer as the mood and situation takes me.

Regards, Greg.P.

John, is the [stationary decoder / hand held] approach a simple, one button effort, or does it require a sequence of button pushes to activate the stationary decoder? And, can these button pushes be done w/o having to stop the engine? I am equally interested in a ladder scenario as well as a solo switch along the tracks.

The other posters certainly make a good case for not using this method. However, I remain intrigued by the [stationary decoder/ hand held] approach. I'll have to try it out before deciding one way or the other.

Thanks! Matt

In all fairness to the pro-DCC crowd, I might also mention that in addition to using the handheld and a stationary decoder you can also use pushbuttons and/or a computer as well. The thing is, except for the added ability to use the handheld, you don't need the expense of the decoder. For me, it simply isn't worth the trouble to be able to use the handheld. Especially since I think it is the most time consuming and awkward possible way to operate turnouts. Some one mentioned using the handheld to perform route selection. Uh, yeah, you ~can~ do that, but you have to remember the route code and take time away from operating your train. A computer or a diode matrix panel in the fascia is faster and easier. Again, using the handheld for doing things other than operating the train is usually the least convenient way to do things. DCC has many "features" and "abilities" that are not very useful to me. I really like it for operating the trains, but for many other functions, there are better ways. Again, Your Mileage May Vary.

Captain Handbrake

Don't restart me on DCC ;-)

A few decades back I was thinking hard about control panels - I was coming out of my Marklin period where (correct) turnout operation consisted of numbered signs beside each turnout, and little eight button turnout switch boxes on the panel. Operation consisted of reading the number beside the turnout and the position required, turning to the switchbox, finding the number, chosing green for straight or red for curve (or was that green for main/red for branch?) Just two steps, but it didn't look good.

The next stage was to hang a numbered track diagram on the wall, and the switch boxes on the panel. Now I had a three step operation - view the turnout location - find the relevant turnout ID on the diagram - find the ID on the switch panel. Well, the cards on the layout were gone.

With a change of layout I had more panel space so I made a diagramatic panel - back to two step operation.

Next came my industrial module (Mks 1-5) which could be a part of the main layout, with hand operated turnouts - one step operation, but when used in conjunction with the main layout I couldn't send a train from the main-line station without being there to throw the turnouts.

For Mk2 I added the Peco point motors - direct operation or remote operation to set the arrival road. The next improvement was route control so that all turnouts would operate from two remote push buttons, for either of the two arrival roads.

The next step was total route control for the industrial layout. The push-buttons were now for routes rather than individual points/turnouts and even hand throwing a turnout caused any other logical turnout to throw. ie in a fan, throwing the last turnout will cause all the preceeding turnouts to align. The current step links all turnouts to the computer. The effect is still the same, but either hand operation or the displayed screen route diagram will throw all turnouts in a route until there is a clash with an already called conflicting route. My routes are simple track to track key inputs eg T01T20 Enter. (Track 01 to Track 20). That system has a small complication where there is more than one possible route, where an intermediate track has to be input. (eg T01T05T20-Enter) It's fun watching other operators discover their entire route is set when they've only pushed one turnout! :-) Ohh, being Peco turnouts, the closed off routes automatically become dead - no isolating switches.

Regards, Greg.P.

Well, I'm one of those pro-DCC guys and I happen to agree with you. Like you say, the selection process is the killer - it's too awkward.

If I wanted to use decoders, I think I'd use a computer with a graphic of the layout on screen. Touch-screen selection of turnouts would be neat, but a little pricey.

If I was forced to use the non-computer method, I'd opt for a separate handheld controller just for the turnouts - and fascia labels with the number of the turnout displayed.

Mike Tennent "IronPenguin" MRR Electronics Special Effects Lighting

Something like this? (The light colored rectangle is the edge of the touch screen.)