wrote
They could use a 'reach wagon' to allow them to attach to wagons actually
inside (or beyond) a good shed, but I can't give an authoritive answer to
your question.
Some wagons could also be shunted by horses, capstans or even manually.
John.
Looking at track plans there seems to be no way to avoid engines
passing through goods sheds at some locations (the covered type with
doors at each end that is).
There was definately a prohibition on gunpowder vans entering sheds
and I seem to remember reading somewhere about a 'prohibition' on
engines passing through sheds due to the risk of sparks setting fire
to the rafters and/or goods on the internal platform.
Anyone know if engines were run through sheds in practice (perhaps
with the steam shut off to prevent sparks or some such)?
I have trawled through all the litereature I have access to and cannot
find any mention of this.
Regards
Mike
In my experience , steam locomotives did not pass into goods sheds.
Any movements within the building ( or under canopies such as at
dockside sidings) were worked with capstans - usually water hydraulic
powered- or with horses. In later days I have observed ex road
vehicles modified to shoulder or tug wagons. Small diesels however ,I
have seen inside.
Peter A
Montarlot
snipped-for-privacy@notigg.not.no wrote in
news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
Not quite the same thing but after the line was closed by Beeching there
was for quite some time a large tank engine stored in the goods shed at
Helmshore, it didn't dissapear until the line was finally lifted in the
early 70s.
Back on topic, I'm sure that there was at least one shed on the Settle and
Carlisle, where engines were permitted inside, sure I read it in a book
recently. I have seen other other occassional references to this practice
elsewhere but I can't bring them to mind at the moment.
One clue - An auction site was selling . . .
A GWR wooden notice with cast letters ?No Engine To Enter This Shed?.
31? square. In original condition.
Doesn't specify goods shed but that seems likely
Regards
Mike
snipped-for-privacy@notigg.not.no wrote in
news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
...
"Stations and Structures of the Settle and Carlisle Railway", V R Anderson
and G K Fox
Pages aren't numbered however page relating to Lazonby, shows image of
Lazonby Goods Shed, cattle trucks and other stock clearly parked on what
would appear to be a run-around (from the track plan) outside dated 1913.
Caption for plate 186 on this page reads ...
"... The wheel scotch, just outside the shed door was an item usually
provided on the rail at each end of the shed where through running was
allowed ..."
Does that help?
Very interesting Chris, as you highlight a discrepancy between the
signalling diagram and the track plan (fig 71 one page back). Fig 72
(sig diagram) clearly indicates a double slip at the right hand end
whereas fig 71 (dated 1911) shows a 3 way point.
Fig 71 certainly reveals that the track with the cattle wagons on it is
the siding behind the goods shed and *not* the loop next to the Down
line. This siding is *not* shown on the signalling diagram fig 72 which
is a drawing "based on information available for 1955".
It would appear that either something is wrong or that changes were
carried out between 1911 & 1955 which led to the cattle wagon siding
being removed.
Regards
Kevin Martin
The capstans were used to move the wagons not (AFAIK) the engines,
they were (typically) about a eighteen inches high, a vertical
cylinder with a slightly pinched centre sitting on a rectangular
plate. The top of the cylinder was about ten inches across, these were
powered by various means including electric motors and hydraulic
motors. The rope was attached to the wagon (there were holes in the
chassis or metal loops on the chassis sides known as 'horse hooks'
used for attaching horses, these were commonly used for capstan
working), the shunter would throw a couple of turns over the capstan
so the wagon was drawn along (capstans ran all the time when shunting
was in progress). As the wagon approached the desired point the rop
was cast off the capstan.
When an engine had to be moved with no fire in the boiler one option
was to attach it to a working engine and drag it back and fore with
the steam valves set for the opposite direction of travel - this
pumped air into the cylinder and allowed the engine to make its way
(for example) onto the turn table and then into the shed.
What I have on capstans . . .
Thanks Chris - I get the impression that it was allowed in some sheds
but not others, possibly because of the design of the building (roof
trusses etc.)
I will keep digging
Regards
Mike
I don't know where you are mike but Bristol City Docks at Princes
Wharf and at Z shed at Canon's Marsh still had some of these
devices 12 years ago. The Bristol Archive may be able to help you.
wrote
Also used at the top of the ramps to coaling stages. The preserved stage
at Didcot has one such. In this case it would have been for weight
restriction reasons - the ramp was usually well-rammed rubble (sometimes
brick arches) but the stage was brick with a void under the concrete deck,
used as a store. It could hold a couple of 10T wagons but not a loco.
A significant number of horses were employed by BR even, as they were
versatile and low-maintenance power. The last one retired from Newmarket
(appropriately) in about 1967, since the station site there is pretty
cramped and single track in and out plus the Warren Hill tunnel, so shunting
with loco movements was a right pain. Come to that, it's not impossible to
move single wagons by pinchbars under the wheel treads, though I imagine
that was banned as regular practice by union decree, as most injuries
happened in goods yards. In its last months of operation (late 2004) I
visited the quarry line at Barrington cement works and that still fed wagons
into the chalk tippler by the time-honoured method of an unfitted wagon
being unhooked by a shunting pole and rolled down a slight gradient with a
bod walking alongside holding the brake lever with a brake stick. After
tippling it was then gravity-rolled out the other end and reconnected into
the empties rake (I think they ran five wagons at a time) which was then
coupled up to the loco and worked down to the chalkface again. I got a ride
in the cab of one, a Hill Vanguard. Never again: gone gone gone... only glad
I got some photos, wish I'd taken a dozen more rolls of film. (And you try
working out a way to model that activity - it might be doable with the
wagons independently powered with that High Level drive gizmo for faking
loose shunting, but it doesn't look the same without the human activity
alongside).
Tony Clarke
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