Jerry, I'm starting to see why a lot of people plonk you! We're not talking about straightening a chassis, if we were, then 1/4" would be acceptable. FWIW, the "B" is monocoque, with no chassis anyway! Go read some of BL's factory manuals for confirmation of these facts. What was being talked about was the lowering of the car by 1", and i am sorry, but unless you are driving round a circuit on track days with very accurate timing equipment, then the difference in driving/lap times due to the c of g being lowered by
1" is immeasurable during normal road use. Anyone who thinks otherwise is an ignoramus who has been fooled by hype not fact. (One thing that is noticeable is the harsher ride gained by fitting "lowering springs" or suchlike.)
No Jerry, there is nowhere near the demand for "B" restoration as there was, say, 10 years ago. At that time I knew of 4 people restoring them locally to me, now there is only one. Supply and demand, I think it's called. The "fad" for restoring a badly put together, underpowered, unreliable, bad handling rustbucket has thankfully passed. Must admit though, for all their failings they had their fun moments. BTW, I refuse to stoop to profanity. Badger.
Did you heard that the administrators have stated that they are not honouring any warranty claims - I just hope that there are some kind hearted dealers or that the cars are hyper reliable...
No it would not, chassis jigs allow a + or - 2.5mm errors [1], AIUI factory assembly jigs allow a bit more - these are figures for older non CAD/CAM processes.
[1] meaning that the error should only be 2.5mm.
It still has a chassie you utter plank, it's just built into the body panels - WTF do you think the front and rear suspention get bolted to ?!
talked about
equipment,
otherwise is an
You really are clueless, we are talking about the RAISING of the ride height, if you can't see what that will do to the handling than you must have been asleep when you were doing your C&G suspension module - assuming, of course, that you are qualified...
that....
Possibly due to the Heritage shells, but basically good ones still get restored, but these days they get restored and not patched...
Hmm, so all the ones that pass through the bodyshops that I either have dealing with or know are just figments of people imagination then, although I will admit that the 'Cheque Book' investor has (thankfully) gone on to pastures new.
Well as my 'F' is getting on for ten years old I don't think it will be an issue for me.
As far as warranties are concerned I would have thought that anyone buying a car has a contract with the retailer and not the manufacturer or administrator.
Ok, so BL factory manuals for Jag XJ series, Landrover SIII and Defender, Maxi, TR7, Princess are all wrong in stating that "when carrying out chassis/body alignment checks, all measured drop-points must be within 1/4" of nominal dimension"? I take it then that you, Jerry, are a higher authority than the factory?? Don't dig yourself a bigger hole.
What's a "chassie"? Is it made of wood, hence your reference to a plank?
They bolt (in most cases) to Longitudinal reinforcement members, the term "chassis" when discussing motor vehicles is only used to describe a separate, structural skeleton which provides strength to an otherwise unsupported or semi-rigid body structure. A vehicle constructed in a unitary method whereby the body and chassis are permanently bonded/welded together and act together to form a rigid single member is called a monocoque. Go read Light and Heavy Vehicle Technology by M.J. Nunney, the "bible" for City and Guilds 383, the servicing and repair of motor vehicles.
Quite probably more qualified than you, judging by your perceived lack of knowledge and terminological errors so far. Whether it was raised or lowered
1" is relative to which one you took as the baseline, the chrome or rubber model. I merely used the word "raised" as an indicator of a 1" change in height, and all other things being equal (spring rate, camber, castor, trail, toe etc) then you will NOT notice a 1" change during normal road driving! 2" is just about noticeable by experienced track drivers on the road, 3" would be noticeable by most drivers. More noticeable would be the change from one brand of tyre to another, or as I have previously stated, the alteration of spring rates and the resultant change in roll characteristics.
Quite possibly a fair comment, although I fail to see how the replacement of complete floorpan, sills and castle sections (on a jig, of course) can be referred to as "patching"?
I agree with you re. the cheque-book investor, they were responsible for some stupid prices back in the late 80's. I watched Series III E-Type DHC's go from a realistic 8-12k to almost 50k overnight! I think if the figures could be accurately monitored however, you'd find that there are nowhere near as many MGB's getting restored now as there were 10-15 years ago. Badger.
Isn't it a sure fire sign that you've lost the argument and have nothing more to contribute when you resort to personal insults against the other person? Ah well, welcome to my Kill file.
The above post has no point whatsoever, except to massage the ego of some sad git. Who gives a toss whether they are in your killfile or not?
PLONK-ER
I was enjoying this argument between people who seem to know either vast amounts about cars, or nothing about cars, depending on whose side you take. It may have gone way O/T but has been the best debate I have seen on this board for years. Thanks folks.
In message , crazy_horse snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.co.uk writes
Ah another one devoid of manners. He was added to my killfile (although I understand he is already in many others) because of the constant abuse he seems to spout as soon as someone disagrees with him or fields another point of view. If you really want a serious in depth discussion about MGs (though E types are clearly the dogs bollocks in my opinion) then go to one of the many car groups on Usenet. And since you seem to belong to the same abusing ilk that Jerry does, you are cordially invited to my killfile too. Goodbye.
Re-posted here as for some reason I can't respond directly!
Hehehe, true to form Jerry, resort to profanity! I have an Honours Degree in Mech Eng, various CGLI certificates ranging from Fibre Reinforced Plastics to Aeronautical Engineering and I currently run an uninstalled aero-engine test house for Rolls-Royce gas turbine engines, oh and I have been restoring cars as a hobby for 25 years. Hardly a "grease monkey", I have the right to call myself a Technician, unlike most of the monkeys working on vehicles nowadays! I prefer to communicate with engines using a computer these days, but that's probably beyond you. You just keep taking the tablets Jerry, I'm sure your doctor, sorry, psychiatrist means well.......
The sad thing is Jerry doesn't *need* to do this, he does post some interesting stuff from time-to-time. Got to admit he's been in my kill-file on a couple of occasions, but when others answer his posts it makes it difficult to totally avoid him. I decided it's better to get his posts first hand, and just ignore him when he goes off on one! :-)
You might be a keen armature car restorer but that does not mean you know anything about it, the fact is you don't and just because you have some fancy bits of paper that say you remembered certain fact on a certain day does not mean you know anything more, and just because you tell others what they should be doing doesn't mean that you know anything - just look at all the accountants telling Doctors how to run hospitals...
Put simply, you are a bodger with little or no knowledge of repairing car bodyshells and no experience jigs and straightening out bent chassis legs.
What jigs have you used, Churchill-Cellete, Car-Bench, Car-O-Liner or one of the many others ?....
A lot of people 'Go off on one' when people accuse them of lying whilst plainly demonstrating that they don't know the first thing about what they are talking about....
(1) Why are we talking about armatures now? Do my motors need rewinding? Is that why my trains are derailing?
(2) Why should a Doctor of Medicine (with his "fancy bits of paper that say he remembered certain fact on a certain day") be more skilled in running a hospital than an accountant?
I like to top post. It's what we do in the hospital I help to run. Even the Doctors top post here. When we let them near the computers, that is.
They may be OK on whipping out - sometimes they even take out the right one - but it's not as if they know about anything important like using pivot tables in budget spreadsheets, or stopping my trains from derailing.
No, not much, just 25 years. Can't you read properly? Oh, and for what it's worth, I am extremely well respected around my local area as a motor engineer, I have set up my own garage repair business in anticipation of impending voluntary redundancy from the MOD and I am currently turning work away as there aren't enough hours in the day! I do not advertise, all my work comes in through recommendations from satisfied customers. I have a good reputation for carrying out quality work for a reasonable cost - I am fortunate enough to have cleared my mortgage and also have considerable savings, I do what I do out of want, not need!
I am not, and never have been, part of an electric motor or relay! ;-)
Legal qualifications, recognised by all the major engineering institutes around the world. My world, that is, obviously not yours! BTW, what are your qualifications, Jerry?
Ahem. NVQ's prove an ability to do the job through practical experience, not passing an exam.
I never told anyone what to do within the context of this thread though, did I? At my work, I work as part of a team, even though I am technically "in charge". I find that by practicing the arts of teamwork and co-operation (words that I doubt you can understand - or spell!) that I get a happier workforce, working environment and productivity is improved as a result.
Let me ask you this, could the driver of the train run the railway better than the managers? Could the Doctor run the hospital? I doubt it, as their expertise lies in different areas, yet that is what you imply.
Personally, I wouldn't want to straighten a chassis leg, have you never heard of Young's Modulus or Work Hardening? In my personal opinion, I would rather replace the damaged part than straighten it, for bending a second time is a bodge if ever there was one! A bent and straightened piece of metal is weaker than the original un-damaged form that it previously held, and as a result may fail drastically if a further impact occurred, possibly with dire consequences. Do you actually understand what crumple zones are, or how they protect you in an accident? From the way you talk, I doubt if you do.
I've used a car-o-liner once, a long time ago, but that's all. I never said I used professional jigs now, did I? A friend and I manufactured a jig some years ago using an immacculate un-bodged MGB shell, to allow for the undertaking of correctly aligned major repairs to a second shell. Badger.
That is email, this is Usenet, I hope you take greater care about how you are told to do things by those who know one end of a syringe for the other....
out the
derailing.
That's when they are not spending money on their own offices, the ward might get a new table for Matron to do her paperwork at, back room accountants get a 1500 quid office.....
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