Hornby Class 50 problems (DCC)

Any advice appreciated.

I have a Hornby class 50 (Ark Royal) fitted with a Lenz 1035 decoder. I was bought the model as a present but it was some time before I could run it and when I did I found its running to be very erratic. It would stall when moving, or not start without a firm nudge etc and its speed was variable when running. I put it away as something to investigate when I had time. I then put it back on the track after a few months and it worked perfectly and continued to do so. I got it out again last week and it is back to its bad old ways. It seldom starts unassisted and when it is running it is worse on straight track than on corners. Sometimes when it stutters the head and tail lights briefly change ends, i.e. the headlight on the back will flash briefly. I have cleaned the wheels to no avail and wonder if I have a problem with the pickups. Does anyone have any advice on dismantling the thing or on how the pickups are attached or even any other suggestions.

Thanks

ROB

Reply to
Robert Flint
Loading thread data ...

Are you running on dc or Dcc?

If Dcc, i presume you know how to get into the model?

It sounds like a loose connection on iehter pick up leads or chip. i would try it on dc if running dcc now, if the problem goes then a new chip or at least investigating the chip would seem to be the answer.

Reply to
Piemanlarger

I have a Hornby class 50 (Ark Royal) fitted with a Lenz 1035 decoder.

Gives it away I think piemanlarger ;-) as suggested, change decoder and also try dc. If still erractic, clean the wheels and investigate the pickups.

Reply to
funky2k

does not mean he fitted the chip himself though? I have fitted several chips for fellow club members who did not know how to do the fitting, new fangled technology scares most people?.

as suggested, change decoder and also

Reply to
Piemanlarger

Rob, How clean is your track ? Where muck is involved, things always seem to run better on the curves that straights due to the bogies and wheels etc being moved against the rails by the curvature of the tracks... Or something like that (It's late and I'm tired!)

Give the track a good clean including the insides of the top. You would be surprised how much the flange is relied on for current pick up. I found that with a Bachmann 04

Reply to
Andy Sollis

"funky2k" wrote

Two additional suggestions:-

1] Get rid of the capacitors 2] If this is the version with traction tyres, replace them with new wheels - available as Hornby spares.

John.

Reply to
John Turner

Rob,

The Hornby class 50 has had a few upgrades in its time so it is not immediately apparent which version you have. The first version which had traction tyres also had an incorrectly made motherboard (wired incorrectly for DCC). From the symptoms you describe, it does not sound like your motherboard needs upgrading, but certainly, the light flicker is what I experienced when one of my 50's had traction tyres. When contacting Hornby for replacement wheels I found that they don't supply the wheels individually, instead, supplying a whole bogie. It is actually easier to pop the keeper plates on the bogies and change the wheels than it is to replace the bogies. Once the wheels were replaced, the flickering stopped.

The pickups on this loco are unique. Behind the exterior plastic bogie frames you will find that the axles run in brass bearings with a brass strip which runs the length of the bogie. A wire connects this to the motherboard. Unless you have been running the loco in a dirty environment or over-lubricated it, I think it is unlikely that these will be dirty.

My suggestion is in agreement with others: #1 replace wheels #2 check decoder after this and if it still doesn't work, change the decoder

Hope this helps,

Graham Plowman

Reply to
gppsoftware

It's about time I got rid of the tyres on mine - do you have the part number? Can you supply these or should I contact Hornby directly?

Adrian

Reply to
Adrian B

According to the Hornby service sheet downloadable here:-

formatting link
then the complete bogie assembly is part number X9232, with a letter suffix for some of the models.

Reply to
airsmoothed

Andy

The track is fine. It is cleaned regularly and every other loco runs perfectly.

The fact that there is a difference between curves and straights is what led me to suspect the pickups but I am not sure if this is a viable theory given the description of them by another poster.

ROB

ROB

Reply to
Robert Flint

"Robert Flint" wrote Andy

The track is fine. It is cleaned regularly and every other loco runs perfectly.

The fact that there is a difference between curves and straights is what led me to suspect the pickups but I am not sure if this is a viable theory given the description of them by another poster.

ROB

Rob, Fair comment... In that case, I'm at a loss of what to suggest without physically seeing it. I was lucky that mine ran like a dream out the box and was still going when the 17 coaches behind fell over on the corner due to the weight. Fantastic loco !

I would hole heartedly recommend changing to the new wheel;s without traction tyres. the less "crud" that can be put back on the track the better...

Failing that, as your DCC and computer literate, treat yourself to a SPROG II and have the computer interface with Decoder pro to you locos. You may find there is something set wrong on the chip that it just doesn't like, such as the BEMF ?

Reply to
Andy Sollis

Andy

I have a Sprog II and the decoder is as per factory defaults apart from the address. When looking at the loco's PCB I was surprised to see that the connections from the pickups and to the motor and lights etc are not soldered on. They are just pushed through a hole which is then held as an interference fit by square plastic caps. I had assumed that these plastic caps where mini connectors. I will do a bit of continuity checking and check that all is as it should be.

As an aside, does anyone know what all those transistors are doing on the PCB? It seems like overkill to me!

ROB

Reply to
Robert Flint

I did fit the decoder myself and am aware it needed plugging in 'backwards' on the early locos (which this is, it has the traction tyres also). I have fitted many decoders, both socketed and hard wired, without problems.

Thanks for your thoughts.

ROB

Reply to
Robert Flint

Graham

How did you release the keeper plates?

ROB

Reply to
Robert Flint

You could say that! I suspect it would be cheaper for them to have installed a DCC decoder instead of designing that ridiculous board.

The purpose of the transistors is to turn on the appropriate lights depending on the direction, and to provide voltage regulation to give the constant lighting level above the trigger threshold. The board is powered by a bridge rectifier connected the opposite way round to a decoder. ie the blue wire on the socket is connected to negative, the blue wire on a decoder is positive. There is no current limiting component in circuit so if a decoder is plugged in correctly it puts a direct short across the rails through the decoder bridge and the loco board bridge in series. One or both will fry. When the decoder is plugged in without the blue wire connected, then the yellow or white wires turned on triggers the appropriate transistor. But with no blue wire connection its only a half wave connection and the trigger can be a bit uncertain.

All the functionality you need for the lights is in your decoder so I much prefer to remove the Hornby board. The only snag is that the LEDs are all wired common negative while DCC requires common negative and rearranging the connections is rather fiddly. But worth it IMHO. Whilst doing that you can seperate the tail light control and have the head and tail lights on different function outputs. Keith

Reply to
Keith

John

Did you remove all the capacitors? There is an electrolytic on the PCB and also one under the PCB in addition to the several yellow ones.

ROB

Reply to
Robert Flint

The electrolytic on the pcb is to provide a smooth DC for powering the lighting board and the LEDs unless you get rid of the Hornby board you don't want to mess with it. What John is referring to are the interference suppression capacitors connected directly to the motor. I did not need to remove these but it does depend on the decoder you are using. If the decoder is a 'feedback (or back emf) type then the caps coupld be interfering with smooth control. Keith

Reply to
Keith

Hi all My mate has a large logo 50035 which doesn't (I think) have traction tyres on it. He has put an SWD Mk1 decoder in it and it runs as well as I think it should, and all the lights work as factory fitted. As it only goes on and off shed light diesel, there is no requirement to turn the tail lights off so he doesn't need that.

I really think Hornby and SWD have done well - seperately.

Phil

Reply to
Waldviertler

IIRC they have clips on the sides of the internal frames - you can see them behind the backs of the wheels. I just used a screwdriver from above (ie body taken off) to lever them and release them.

Graham Plowman

Robert Fl> > Rob,

Reply to
gppsoftware

"Waldviertler" wrote

Perfectly feasible, the early ones had traction tyres, but the number of complaints to Hornby forced them to abandon them for the second production batch.

John.

Reply to
John Turner

PolyTech Forum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.