Q, old unusual equipment

Oct 22, 2005 10 Replies

First an observation. I drove my Jeepster over the Rubicon Trail with about



15 other Jeepsters a few weeks ago. A couple of guys brought ReadyWelders,
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, and that was a good thing. One guy broke a leaf spring off at the eye, that took a 3 welds with little bits of steel we found added on to get him out. A couple of guys broke driveshafts, spring perches, or steering box mounts, and these all welded up fine. A few guys broke axles, but there were enough spares to go around. I had the opportunity to show off my technique for welding cast iron to steel when my front spindle pulled all the bolts out of the iron knuckle, as no one had a drill and tap set. That took 2 tries to get it out. It's the most brutal trail i have been on, and most people take 2 days to go 27 miles..

Anyway, I have decided that an on-board welder is a great idea, but I won't be shelling out $600 for one until after I have a nice TIG in the shop. Today at a garage sale i bought for $2 an old Montgomery Wards "home shop welder". It weighs about 25 Lbs, and says it is rated at 110V, 15A input and



50A output at arc 25V, open circuit 45V, and can weld up to 1/4 inch. As I will be installing a 130A 12V alternator, i should be able to barely feed it, but the battery will help. It has one control, the "on" switch. It has a feature that i am not familiar with, it can either use stick, or be a "Carbon Arc" welder, and has directions on the case. You use two carbon rods (don't have them) and one holder mounts to the other on the clamp so you throttle the arc in one hand. Very strange, I guess that's the heat control?

It appears that I may have been able to braze my spindle with it. Is this carbon arc worth messing with? My old textbooks don't mention it, but Machinery's Handbook at least has a short reference. Can this be used to cut? Anyone have any info on this?



Thanks,


Also, I think an inverter will run me about $200 to cover a 1725 Watt draw, would i be better off doing an alternator conversion like this?

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don't have room for another belt-driven accessory, but i guess it could be a temporary add-on.

I would get some electrodes and practise using your Montgomery Wards welder at home before investing in an inverter to run it.

Forty five volts Open Circuit is pretty low.

You can use carbon arc to braze. I am surprised your books don't have any information on it. Try the library.

Dan

Converting an alternator to a weldor seems like a better idea than buying an inverter. There are better articles on doing the conversion than the one you have found. The ones I remember convert the alternator from a Y to a Delta so it can be used at higher currents. You can use an older alternator where the regulator is not part of the alternator, so you ought to be able to find one at a wrecking yard or scrap yard.

Dan

The little 'Home Shop' welder you have is cute and does work but not terribly useful. You will have to experiment and find which size rod it likes. I'd suggest trying a few sticks of 5/64" or 3/32" 6011, see which one runs better. If the rod gets red hot, use a bigger one. If it gives a cold weld, go to the smaller. As someone else suggested, try it out before investing in an inverter. It will run better on standard AC so it you can't use it at home forget about it on the trail.

As for the carbon arc, your unit should be able to run one of these:

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have one, they do work fine for brazing although the arc 'flame' is much larger than a O/A torch. I also have some Popular Mechanics books showing the use of a singe carbon torch head that is about the same vintage as your little welder. One problem you might run into is that the twin carbon unit is turned on and runs for as long as you are working on the piece, 5 to 10 minutes might be typical. Your little welder is unlikely to have that high a duty cycle.

All that said, I have a special love for those little twerps of a welder. I built a similar one, used it, burned out one coil, rewound it, etc etc. When you get mad at it, stick it in a box and I'll pay the UPS charges. :)

Stupendous Man wrote:

Tha carbon arc is what intrigues me. I will have to go to town next week and get some carbons from the welding supply. It says on it to use 1/16 rod on heavy stuff. It should be fun to play with, anyway. This thing does have a 20% duty cycle, but like my old mini-mig, a fan would probably help cool the coils..

I used to have one of those. In fact I threw it out of the barn into the trash, a few months ago. I doubt that it had been used in 20 years, and may have still worked, I don't know. I tossed it because I needed the room, and I was getting rid of stuff I didn't use anymore. It had water dripping on it off and on for about 20 years, was covered with about 20 pounds of spider webs and dust, I didn't need it, and I didn't think anyone would have wanted it for anything, Besides even when new it wasn't that great of a performer.

Mine had a sliding lever on the front of the box that adjusted the output. The scale went from about 20 to 90 and I guess it had a rough relation to the amount of amps it was supposed to be putting out. Mine required a 20amp

120AC power source. It had the odd plug where one blade was turned sidewise.

I did use 1/8 and 3/16 welding rods with it. 6010/6011's IIRC. But you had to keep the rods in an air tight container and they worked best if they had been baked first and were still warm as the power of the welder was so low. We did do a lot of repairs around the farm with it years ago, it just took a lot of time and a lot or passes to build up the welds.

I long ago lost the carbon holder. You put a carbon rod in each side, set the angle and adjusted them so the tips would meet when you squeezed the handles together. When you were ready to weld, turn the power on, bring the tips of the carbons together to strike an arc, once the arc was going you used the arc like you would a gas torch to weld with. You could also use a single carbon or two carbons and an air hose to cut/gouge with if you were brave and fearless. I still have a few ¼ inch carbons around here someplace. You can use carbons to heat with if you run out of Ox/Act. Even with ¼ carbons, and at the max setting of 90 Amps (?), there was a lot of light and smoke but not a lot of heat.

I have seen 3/8, 7/16, and even 1/2 inch carbons used for welding. Welding carbons are always copper coated. Carbons used in arc lights, search lights and the old movie projectors used at the drive-in theaters used an uncoated carbon rod.

I wouldn't think he would be able to run 6011 with that low of an OCV ... or at least I could never run 6011 using my little 110v buzzbox.

Hmm, I hadn't thought about the effect of trying it with a tiny rod, like maybe 1/16". I only tried it with 3/32 ... definitely a no-go. Actually, now that I think about it, I remember the manual specifically saying not to use

6011 (or 7018) ... 6013 or 7014 only. But again, that was for the buzzbox I had -- an old Century -- and it had more amps to work with (up to 100). I agree -- 50 amps is not much to work with, and I am doubtful about how satisfactory the welds will be, especially on anything of any thickness. Even with 100 amps, my old Century would just barely do 1/8" steel adequately. 1/4" was very, very iffy at best ... although I have to admit I was still a very green weldor at the time. It would be interesting to see what I could do with it now, but alas, I sold it long ago ...

Stupendous Man, let us know how it goes with this little buzz box!

I will, it wont be until late next week when I go to the welding shop. It says on it to use these sized rods for these, 1/4 inch carbon for solder/brazer, 1/16 for up to 1/4 inch metal, 3/32 for up to 1/16 metal, and

5/64 rod for "light metal". I only have 1/8 rod, but will get a few small sticks to play with. It's is in great condition, it spent it's life in the box. The best purpose for this thing might be as an arc lamp for haloween.

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