A Solution....Yes its about AMA

paragraph 5 of the AMA Club charter - To participate in flying activities..... MUST be an AMA member.

I can't fault them for that, that is a good rule, otherwise people would not be members, and there would be no income and no AMA.

Phil

"Mike R." wrote:

Ummmm........ahhhhhh.......Good Idea. Give it a go at your club and come back and tell us how it worked out. I would be as happy as a pig up to his ears in Bandini mountain to hear that your plan was well received by your club and successfully implemented.

Abel

ROFLOL! Able, you crack me up with your understatement.

Talk about an easy way to loose a flying field! Let the club landlord find out that they are allowing unisured to play there and guess what happens next.

And just who in hell is going to keep track of who's who and all the paperwork when trying to find a volunteer to simply cut a patch of grass or come to a meeting is almost impossible? And when a mistake is made, and an accident happens, who THEN is going to do all the footwork to try to get a claim paid?

MJC

About as lame-brain as an AMA EC member. AMA membership means that THE OTHER GUY CAN COMPENSATE ME- ME-ME WHEN HE PUTS ME IN A WHEEL CHAIR OR WORSE. The average HO insurance is a drop-in-the-bucket when it comes to real accident potential liability expense. I carry umbrella ins. to help those that I might hurt. DO YOU??

If someone wants to fly at my club's field, he has to be AMA. Whether he ever gets to fly cheap-skate is beyond any care of mine. AMA load or hit road.

HC

About as lame-brain as an AMA EC member.

C'mon Hoss - whether you like it of not, Mike has proposed a new thought into what has has been for far to long a very stale subject. Screw your self-centered bavo sierra about how every other participant in model aviation owes it to you to pay for insurance coverage to provide for your welfare in case of an accident. Nobody pays for insurance coverage to compensate you, except in socialist states that mandate it as for automobile drivers. Except for for those instances where the free market has been preempted by the socialists, insurance is provided to protect those that pay for that protection. Buy you own damned insurance, and wheelchair too if you're that paranoid about it. Else sit at home and fret about the

Abel

SNIP

ROFLOL!

He couldn't be, he is too short and ugly! . . . . . . . . I just couldn't pass that one up. It is like pulling the flaps up before taxing to parking.

Well here ya go....Cain and Abel at it again. ;-)

Dr.1 Driver "There's a Hun in the sun!"

Homeowners IS primary, but are you going to patrol the flying field to make sure everybody's homeowner's polcies cover R/C, and are paid up? Dunno about you, but I want to fly when I'm at the flying field, not play insurance agent.

The insurance is not about the modelers, its about the flying site property owner and other people that maybe visiting/watching, flying technically is not even a requirement. Hypothetical, your club is an ama club and allows this one day non ama flyer (John Smith) fly at your clubs site. Joe's plane goes astray and hits a visitor causing him serious injuries. The visitor requires a 100K operation becuase of the injury. John Smith has no assets to speak of, works a minimum wage job, has no net worth. So the visitor sues the club. AMA can legally bow out because the club didn't enforce the rule. That leaves the club and potentially the property owner liable. The property owner probably is ok becuase your club said it had AMA insurance. So guess who it costs, you and all the rest of the membership. In all probablility your homeowners or umbrella policy won't do you a lick of good because you knowingly broke the AMA's rules. YOUR ON YOUR OWN!

I'm not say> On 16 Jul 2004 03:02:33 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@aol.com (CainHD) wrote: >

Phil- Neither my HO nor umbrella policies make any mention of compliance with AMA rules while I am engaged in activities involving model airplanes being a condition of coverage. Do your's? FWIW, the umbrella policy does specifically mention that coverage is excluded if the model airplane is carrying human passengers. I can live with that, Limiting the passenger manifest to hamsters and other critters that are subhuman (inclusive of lawyers, I assume - that would be real fun and who would object?).

Abel

Hmmm...... MY homeowners does NOT insure the landlord, does yours?

(Snipped the pearls of wisdom by HC)

Not true, this idea has been batted around several times this I can remember. As others have stated.... keeping track of who has insurance, when they have it, and when it expires would be more work than those that volunteer are willing to do. This has been stated, by said individuals every time this idea comes up for discussion.

One of the greatest problems, we face in America is that people want what they want, even if they can't afford that particular desire. The very bottom line, is that if you can't afford the AMA membership, then you can't really afford to fly R/C. The whole proof of insurance has been hashed out before. At this point, the only way to know for certain that coverage exists is with the AMA, or at this point the UMA. However, my bet is on the AMA at this time. They have a long history whereas the other does not, and could likely go the way of SFA. This would leave those members in limbo for certain.

Right back at you. I should not have to protect myself from some other person. I should be able to live life knowing that if an individual does cause me harm, they have the means (personally or via insurance) to protect me. You may think that you only look out for yourself, which sort of looks bad on you, but maybe you ought to look out for others instead. Might make for a better place....... but then again this will never happen as long a people only care about themselves first! So, I carry insurance to protect others, AND I carry insurance to protect me in the event some jack-ass without the insurance or means causes me injury (material or personal).

Robert

Hey Phil, if what you just said is 100% correct.......then read the very top line I wrote in my first post.......You would not need AMA insurance at all!!

Mike

No....its not that I cant afford them its just that the AMA is an option now a days.......ELECTRIC.

Mike

Ok, let me try to go thru again. Assuming the club doesn't own the property, they lease it. Most landlords require the club to have insurance to cover any accident involving club activities. If there is no agreement written or verbal, on insurance, then I can't speak to that, but if I were the landowner I sure as he.. would make sure that was a written requirement. If something happens on that property as the result of modeling activity that insurance kicks in. Now if the club is insuring it in a method that has nothing to do with the AMA, then what you say maybe fine. It would depend on the insurance policy. But most homeowners policy prohibit commercial activity. Leasing the land for an RC Club would be considered commercial. If the club pays the AMA for the landowner insurance coverage as part of the club charter (which is optional, btw) the AMA requires any flyers at that site to be AMA members. (there is a couple of exceptions, the AMA does recognize some other foreign institutions, and there is a buddy box training program that has a specific set of rules.) If the modeler is not AMA and that modeller causes an accident that is of a nature to cause a significant claim, the AMA is not obligated to cover. The landowner is not liable because the club was supposed to operate by AMA rules for coverage. The club is in violation and liable. If the club is incorporated, then it gets more complicated but better for the club members. A club can and some do elect commercial insurance, and that may become more and more standard practice as the cost of AMA dues and property owners insurance costs increase. i.e. $57 dollars in ama dues times 100 members would reap $5700, I seriously doubt is commercial coverage is anywhere near that for a lot of sites.

Phil

"Mike R." wrote:

Abel, Just because it doesn't say anything about model airplanes doesn't mean it will cover. There are plenty of "outs" if you read you policy thoroughly.

Phil

Abel Pranger wrote:

Mike, You are right, but the exact same problems exist but they appear to be hidden today. Wait until the LiPoly stuff gets widespread and see how easy it is to find a flying site without AMA insurance. Remember the REAL benifit of the AMA insurance is the landlord protection.