A Solution....Yes its about AMA

This debate constantly comes up. The AMA offer a cheap, easily verified solution that no other company seems to have yet. It is specific to the activity and recognized nearly everywhere. The one thorn in it all is the rabid insistance of everyone being an AMA member before a club can get coverage.

I wouldn't be opposed to public sites not requiring AMA as long as there were provisions for EASILY verifying some other form of insurance that SPECIFICALLY addresses model aircraft operation. Problem is, most homeowners policies don't specifically address it and you probably would NEVER get them to put it in writing.

$3.95.'

No! I'll whip out my State Farm insurance card and show them! I'll even offer to dial the phone to my agent since his name and number is also listed on the card.

Well it's quite obvious you've never read your home owners policy!

I require everyone who boards horses at my barn to have a minimum 300,000 liability (That's in addition to what I have). Most homeowners insurance will cover this either automatically or with a modest rate increase. The boarder must certify (signature) on the contract that they have this coverage and produce either a letter from their agent or the policy itself (I photo copy the pertinent info and keep it on file). My lawyers are satisfied with this arrangement.

But the point is, the homeowners insurance covers the horse even though the horse doesn't and may never set foot on the property (home) the policy covers. When in doubt, ask your agent!

Your state farm insurance card does not prove that your policy covers model aircraft flying activities. Neither can a phone call to your agent prove this. Only the written words in your policy can prove this.

That is where the AMA card is so much easier for a club or landowner to administer. The AMA membership automatically comes with the specific insurance as well as a definite, verifiable expiration date. A homeowners policy can be cancelled at any time but I have not heard of anyone cancelling their AMA insurance as it is an annual purchase.

I would not say never.......they would if you get a large number of people whom are interested. The insurance comp. probally would even draft up a policy for them addressing model aircraft.

Mike

As it stands, the liklihood of getting an insurance company to specifically address model aircraft flying in their coverage (other than to exclude it) seems very remote. Both homeowners companies I had refused to put it in writing even though they told me "no problem" over the phone. They were Farmers and AAA.

In the same vein the AMA card doesn't guarantee the individual will adhere to the rules! Nor does it guarantee the AMA will continue the coverage in the event he doesn't follow the rules. Nor does the AMA card state what the persons claim history might be!

The point is, sooner or later you have to simply trust the person and carry on. If you can't do that, then you have bigger problems that a stupid secondary insurance coverage for toy airplanes.

automatically

Just because State Farm is insurance doesn't mean that you are covered for R/C activities. An AMA card AUTOMATICALLY GUARANTEES to anyone seeing it that you are DEFINITELY covered.

Oh yea, the boarder must "certify" that he has insurance. And if he doesn't, or if his insurance WON'T cover him, what's that "certification" worth? And if your lawyers are happy with that arrangement, and it turns out that a boarder's "certification" is a lie, are your attorneys going to cover the claim out of their own pocket? Suuuurrre. As usual C.O., you exist in your own little world of your own design.

MJC

| Just because State Farm is insurance doesn't mean that you are covered for | R/C activities. An AMA card AUTOMATICALLY GUARANTEES to anyone seeing it | that you are DEFINITELY covered.

No, it doesn't.

First, one could have been thrown out of the AMA, or just asked that the membership be cancled. No more coverage there. (Unlikely, I know. But you did say DEFINITELY in all caps, like it was some sort of God-given truth.)

Second, the card could be fake or altered. Or for somebody else entirely. Of course, that's always a problem with just about anything.

Both of these issues can be verified by calling the AMA and checking some sort of picture ID.

Third, and this is the big one, the AMA has a large list of rules that must be followed, or they may deny you insurance coverage in the event of a claim. Most of the rules are common sense, but pretty much any serious accident could be traced to a violation of some rule somewhere

-- so the AMA can pretty much deny any claim they want, at will. They have not done so in the past, not that I know of, but they could start at any time.

My homeowner's policy pretty much will only deny coverage in the case of the commission of a crime (and I think they further restrict it to a felony.)

I'm not saying that the AMA card isn't a good way of showing that you have insurance -- I'm pointing out that even it's not perfect, as some people seem to think.

When you are simply talking about a simple way to verify coverage, the AMA card is the best. Period. You can throw all kinds of what-ifs into the equation, but all of them apply to any scenario.

I would bet that any insurance you could come up with would have some kind of exclusion statement that would let them out of the coverage. Most times it is the reasonable person type rule.

Gentleman, I had Allstate homeowners insurance years ago when I flew at a heli field (a local heli shops backyard). The owner wanted AMA or a homeowners policy stating coverage for model aircraft. I had no trouble with my agent in requesting a written form stating their coverage for model aircraft and it`s liability limits. I also had AMA at the time, however our aircraft club was talking about the possibility of dropping the AMA charter and allowing the new Sport Flyers Association members in also. Out of personal curiosity, I asked my agent if I could have it in writing as proof of insurance for the club and had no trouble obtaining a writing document from Allstate. To this day this topic comes up and I wish I would have kept it. Long story short I personally knew my agent and perhaps that played a role on my behalf.

I believe what most guys are upset about (myself included) is that AMA requires of a club charter that all members of the club must be AMA members, in other words they have a monopoly over the clubs in that respect. All members want is insurance plane and simple, not the hugh flying field at AMA headquarters that 99% of the membership will never see or fly at. It`s what their doing with our money that membership see`s, that turns us against them. Our club has had several accidents over the years in which we as a club have footed the bill, not the AMA, (at the clubs request). It is usually the life long members that do not want to rock the AMA boat so to speak and I for one can never figure out the true why? rick markel

OTOH, USAA addresses flying model airplanes specifically in their policies as insured. Been a USAA member since 1956. Had a letter OKing model airplanes many years ago. For some years now, the specific item is in the paperwork.

I see where you're not only a legal expert but a horse expert as well! My! My! What talent we have!

automatically

Why would the AMA charter a club and then not require the members to belong to AMA? It seems to me that if flyers don't want to belong to AMA then they wouldn't want to join to an AMA chartered club. Unless of course they want to enjoy the club perks without picking up the bill. I would guess that most AMA members would have no problem seeing them form their own club and go it on thier own.

Phil AMA609

The thing is Jones, you have no talent. You're just a pathetic liar that likes to play Bigshot behind a bogus name. You make a fool out of yourself every time you post here.

By the way, how's that deal coming on the purchase of 100 acres of prime farmland to expand your private airfield. ROFLOL

coverage in

All this nonsense about the AMA. I can fly my foamy park flyer in full view of your club/field/nazi camp without AMA or have no insurance at all. And there ain't a damm thing you can do about it.

That is a REAL FINE attitude! Sure to win friends everywhere. Why not do it sometime and see how long you and your little foam toy last.

| That is a REAL FINE attitude! Sure to win friends everywhere. Why not do | it sometime and see how long you and your little foam toy last.

What's wrong with his attitude? He's absolutely right, as long as local regulations don't prohibit flying outside the AMA field.

And as long as he takes care to make sure that the frequency he uses doesn't interfere with anybody else, there's not even anything morally wrong with him flying near the AMA field.

| > All this nonsense about the AMA. I can fly my foamy park flyer in full | > view of your club/field/nazi camp without AMA or have no insurance at | > all. And there ain't a damm thing you can do about it.

What's wrong with his attitude? Where in there does he say he will check to make sure he isn't interfering with other users?