Before you can take him to task you must first _find_ him.
That's normally done by checking the antique shops in the vicinity of a large-ish model event anywhere in the Southeastern US.
If you do succeed in finding the curmudgeon, and if he perceives you have anything in mind except letting him take your 'snap', he scurries away as fast as he can totter.
Been there, done that. T-shirt never did fit. Cheers, Fred McClellan The House Of Balsa Dust
You could contribute to Tony's campaign. Every little bit helps. Cheers, Fred McClellan The House Of Balsa Dust
And rightly so.
McNeill is no doubt a master of political machinations.
In the last election, he pulled the strings to get Manny Sousa nominated to the ballot. Sousa pulled enough votes away from Tony Stillman to insure McNeill's re-election. The difference was less than a hundred votes.
McNeill has done that for decades. Whenever anyone posed a credible threat, McNeill pulls strings to get a pal nominated, and the pal pulls enough votes away from the challenger to insure McNeill's continuation in office.
Last election was the first time in many years where the challenger even came close to unseating McNeill, and McNeill literally squeaked by one more time.
I don't think it will work that way this time around. Too many people are paying way too much attention, and McNeill is already in hot water for lying to the Executive Council regarding his "trips", particularly in the case where he claimed to have been at an event all day and the CD has publicly stated otherwise.
Methinks McNeill's days at the helm of AMA District V are coming to an end.
I certainly intend doing all I can toward that end. Cheers, Fred McClellan The House Of Balsa Dust
You read it correctly, and what you read is not in any way a misrepresentation of known facts regarding McNeill.
He once flew free-flight models, thirty-odd years ago.
Red 'tricked' him into holding an r/c Tx hooked to a buddy cord once, for less than a minute.
McNeill's hobby is getting elected so he can have the AMA travel funds for his numerous trips around the district.
I'm one of the folks who have seen McNeill's act up close and personal, and lemme tell ya it's a long way from impressive.
If you broach a technical subject McNeill scurries away as fast as he can totter. He's a technological ignoramus.
Yet it is he who makes an alarming percentage of the motions and seconds regarding technical issues, like limiting combat engine size, limiting the on-board fuel for jets, things like that.
A technological ignoramus making technological decisions.
Any more questions about what's wrong with AMA ? Cheers, Fred McClellan The House Of Balsa Dust
McNeill claims two law degrees. With such he would take action if what I have reported were false.
Can you get a copy of his expense reports from Muncie? We have requested them but they (Muncie) refuse to release them. Check your laws on disclosure for non-profit organizations.
If McNeill thought he could make a case against me or anyone else that is aware of his malfeasance in office he would have done it long ago.
Others have filed formal complaints about his dereliction of duty as a VP with the AMA, but his protector has managed to fend them off. "You elected him, he is your problem."
Red S.
No one has been able to take him face to face. He ducks out and then writes letters like this one. I have included the reply from Hall of Fame member (Deceased) Jim Duckworth.
Note his "promises" in the letter. None of which ever materialized.
4/28/98 From the Dixie Aeromaster Inc. Newsletter William W. Atkins 467 W. Seminole Rd. Byron, GA 31008A Rebuttal by Jim McNeill, District V Vice President
1998 is an election year for the AMA District 5 Vice Presidency. I currently hold the office. I am running for re-election. A few weeks ago a Mr. Norman Deputy announced his intention to run also. Curiously, he mailed all of my Associate Vice Presidents a package asking them to nominate him for the office. Contained in the package was a spoon-fed pre-worded nomination addressed to the Nominating Committee. Also an envelope with a 32c stamp on it pre-addressed also. All the Associate VP had to do was follow instructions. 1) sign it; 2) include his or her AMA number; 3) mail it. I have 4 of these in front of me now. To contained the same wording as the one appearing in your DIXIE AEROMASTERS NEWSLETTER now. Only one nomination is necessary. This is all very new. Anyone experienced in AMA matters knows the relationship between a Dist. VP and his Associate Vice Presidents is generally based on trust and a long friendship. At first blush I decided to stay out of it and let Deputy run his own business. Now, however, he has changed his story and has become bolder. For me to remain silent is an error. In his pitch he says: "we as a group, do not communicate very well with each other, and we as AMA members, feel that we are very far removed from the District Vice President, Associate Vice Presidents, the AMA Executive Council and the policies they make on our behalf." My response to this is: RUBBISH. POLITICS. Politics at its lowest level. You, the member, are not very far removed from me, and I am not very far removed from you. In each issue of your Model Aviation magazine I have my address, my phone number, my FAX number, my E-mail snipped-for-privacy@juno.com, now my own WEB PAGE.NORMAN DEPUTY LEADER MEMBER SCIENTIFIC LEADER MEMBER ADMINISTRATIVE
He is indeed a Leader Member but he has not told you how long he has been a Leader Member. He became a Leader Member March 18, 1998. Last month. When Hdq'ers received his first nomination from James Duckworth on March 17 (dated 3-10-98) he was not yet a Leader Member. He became one hours later. Also he states: "...an avid model enthusiast for 10 years..." I'm sure he's telling the truth here but he does not say how long he has been an AMA member. He joined AMA on June 10, 1991. He has been an AMA member for 6 years and 10 months. I have been an AMA member since its inception. In 1939 I was told to stop painting NAA & my membership number on the right upper wings of my models and henceforth put AMA & the number instead. The American Academy of Model Aeronautics had dropped the American word off and was now Academy of Model Aeronautics. I had been a member of NAA for years before then. I have been on AMA's Board of Directors, its Council, for 25 of the last 27 years. Longer than anyone else in AMA's history. If Norman Deputy accesses to the office of Vice Presidency of District V I hope he treats you better than he has treated me. Last Fall he called me on the phone and requested I put an AMA booth in the then forthcoming Southeastern Model Show at Perry, Georgia. I then got in my car and drove to the Georgia Aircraft Modelers Assoc. club meeting in Warner Robins where Deputy was the Club Secretary Treasurer. I offered an AMA booth etc., never at ant time did he as Show Coordinator offer ANY pledge of assistance from any members of his club to help AMA. He said they would all be busy. A very distinguished old-time FFer offered to help but is in poor health. I sent one of my Associate VPs to monitor the booth, drove over myself to see. Whammo!!! SURPRISE!!! The AMA display wasn't in the main room at all where all the action was taking place. It had been sullied off into a side building. I didn't understand at the time but I understand now. As a direct result of the manner in which Norman Deputy treated the Academy of Model Aeronautics at his Perry Show a committee of 3 has been developed here in Birmingham and are creating a Model Show beginning in Jan or Feb of next year in the old Fairgrounds buildings. One of these halls is 3 times the size of the Perry, Georgia one.
My grateful acknowledgements to your fine Club Editor Mr. Bill Atkins and your fine Club President Mr. Jim Harris in allowing me this rebuttal.
copies; All of my Associate VPs.
From Tom Rhodes
After Reading the "Rebuttal" by Jim McNeil to Norm Deputy announcing and campaining for Dist V VP I had to say a few things. Norm Deputy has been nominated for AMA Dist V VP, He has announced he is running and solicited support from the AVP's in his district. Put a web page with a campain statement, and in general has started a clean campain for the AMA District V VP. Norm is actively seeking the AMA District V VP position. Upon seeing some compition Jim McNeil has made a personal attack against Norm. I find it appalling that he would stoop to such petty negative politics. Jim was also a little liberal with the facts in his "Rebuttal".
Jim Said - Not one single time has any members complained I was slow in mailing or to quote Deputy "very far removed."
It took several people incuding myself over 6 months for him to even consider doing anything with the internet. His web page has just now gone up. I called him and sent him many letters over months to get him to say what if anything he planned for District V on the internet. Several emails, faxs, and phone calls to him went Ignored, and he even made dispariging remarks about myself and others because we were pushing him for some kind of action or at least his stance on the District V internet presence. It took requests on other VP's to get Jim to respond. Jim will answer requests and send info as long as it doesn't require him to think or make stand on an issue. Otherwise he has and will ignore you in hopes that you will go away. Some of you may remember the monthly letters to Jim I put on the District VIII email list last year He was brought into the information age kicking and screaming. He had actually dropped doing anything on the net untill Norm 's nomination for VP.
Norm may have just become a "Leader Member" but he's obviously a leader in model aviation. Look at his resume at his web site. He's only been in AMA a little more than 6 years. He's been active for that 6 years. The question is does Jim have 30 years of experience or 1 year of experience 30 times? Jim doesn't fly anymore. His only activity is AMA VP. That might be good but he doesn't really do anything and if anyone does or says anthing critical of any of actions or decisions he takes it as a personal attack. Dissagree with him or question one of his decisions and he fears that you're out for his job. Norm Deputy really is out for his job, so Jim is attacking the man and stretching the facts on the communication issue. Jim is a nice guy but he's not a leader, he doesn't campain for our District but appears to look out for his position as an AMA VP and not look out for the AMA members of his district. He's the consumate AMA politician holding his position longer than anybody in AMA history.
I offered to help and publish and AMA District V web site with links to all the clubs in the district. Put up Club Newsletters, and put up Jims notes and information a year ago. I even got a IP to donate the server space for the site. Jim didn't know what I was offering, and told me he didn't think it was a good idea. He's changed his tune and it's now "Jim's Secret Plan" ..Tom Rhodes AMA531770 snipped-for-privacy@xtalwind.net
From: Jim Duckworth
A District VP Wakes Up
Well I guess we all know now what it takes to wake up a District Vice President. Just challenge their hold on the position. In my association with AMA, and since I am not running I will not bother you with letter and verse of how many years that is, this is the fastest action I have seen on the part of any District V VP, regarding anything. Incidently where did Jim McNeill get the information regarding the where, when etc of Norm Deputy's association with AMA? I wonder if this information regarding McNeill's "history" would be available to anyone. Who cares? Right now we need an active administrator with a desire to become involved in the administration of the hobby and one who can provide the membership with a positive forward looking agenda. We already have an administrator who has sat on the position currently for 8.25 (?) years, but who has resisted coming into the current computer age, and who insists on pointing backwards to the things he has done, but has no statement indicating what he is going to offer in the future. Maybe that is a little hard, because Jim does indicate he has a "secret plan" to put all newsletter front pages on his web site.
Several things in Jim's rebuttal require a response. I detected some concernment in the rebuttal letter due to the fact Norm notified all 17 or so of Jim's AVPs ( whose relationship is "based on trust and a long friendship) of his intention to run for the office. What a better way to start your association with the membership than to notify all the associates of your intentions, and include a self addressed envelope for their convenience. Jim explains it as "this is all very new." Bingo, perhaps Jim just got his first clue as to a great way to service your constituency "convenience." In the rebuttal Jim indicates that 4 of his AVPs forwarded the info Norm sent them to him. This indicates the 4 did not desire to nominate Norm. Jim needs to not worry about the four, but think of the other 13 that may have some desires for a change in District V.
Jim goes off in the rebuttal about Norm's statement that "we do not communicate very well with each other" as rubbish, and then indicates his address on the Model Aviation District V page as his communication tool with the membership. I'll let someone else determine which of the two statements are "rubbish." Jim's web page did not exist several weeks ago when Norm wrote his concerns regarding communication amongst AMA people. Norm has had a web page up and running for about 2 years now and has been communicating and interacting very well through this medium with club members, interested modelers and others for these many years. Probably a very good indication of what we can expect from him in years to come.
In the rebuttal letter Jim wimpers about hoping that Norm will treat "you better than he has treated me," this in regard to the AMA display at the Southeastern Model Show. This display was in my bailiwick at the show, an Norm was very busy with many other duties. Norm made the initial contact with AMA, was told that District V VP should handle it. Norm then made contact with Jim, and all subsequent actions concerning the display were made by me. After several calls by me to Jim, to an AVP etc, the display was shipped to Norm's home address. Now as to the placement of the display, it was not "sullied off into a side building," but placed in the Conference Center, a multi-million dollar media building, used by the Agri-center complex for conferences of all types. Along with the AMA display, the building contained an IMAA display, Southern Scale Warbird, Senior Pattern, and Peach State Quarter Scale displays. While this building did not garner the traffic we hoped for, it was the first year for this arrangement and understandably we will have more exposure for these displays in the future. Now as to this business of "I then got in my car and drove to the GAMA meeting" OK that is a true statement, but next comes "never at anytime did he as show coordinator offer any pledge of assistance from any members of his club." Wrong, at that stage of the planning contact had already been made to have the AMA display, a lease paid on the building for the display etc, all of which was accomplished by "members of this club." Further the display was taken to the Agri-center by Norm, and I set the display up, positioned it and directed the AVP who was to handle it to the area. Jim was at the show, I spoke to him myself in the main building, and if he had so much as mentioned any concerns about the display, I feel sure we could have and would have brought our full attention to the problem. Several times during the show I asked the AVP if Jim McNeill had come to the display, and to the best of my knowledge Jim did not visit the display, or even enter the "sullied off " building.
Now about the meeting with our club. Jim was certainly pleasant enough, but through the evenings discourse, it became perfectly clear to me that Jim has been at the job of District VP long enough, and we need some new thoughts put to the problems of AMA. At one point I asked Jim "If there was any possibility of AMA getting out of the insurance business," and his demeanor immediately took on a defensive nature, and he seemed to bristle at the idea. Answering that there was absolutely no possibility of AMA getting out of the insurance business, adding that AMA had always had insurance. My impression based on this and other responses that evening has led me to believe that much of Jim's thinking and planning hinges on things in the past. Perhaps that is not so bad until you figure that the current communication age is changing so many aspects of our lives, and that we had better have a capable, forward looking person in position to deal with these changes...........Jim Duckworth
"M Dennett" wrote in message news:g6Q_b.10072$ snipped-for-privacy@news20.bellglobal.com...
So have I, Fred. At the April 2003 Fun Fly event at the Spartanburg Sky Knights in Spartanburg, SC, I witnessed his technique. He chatted amiably with Harold Call, member of NCFFA (National Competition Fun Fly Association), an AMA SIG. Harold was the designated CD for the NCFFA Nationals, held in Eutawville, SC, last year. Actually, it was MRS. McNeill who introduced Jim to Harold. Jim had NO idea what NCFFA is, much less what competition fun fly planes are. He didn't even know the NCFFA Nats were scheduled in August 2003 IN HIS OWN DISTRICT. Once again, ol' Jimbo didn't have a clue.
He sidled up to a select few, schmoozing all the way. Meantime, his wife was circulating through the crowd, getting attendees to write down their names, so the McNeills could be absolved of misspellings. Neither of them spoke to me....in fact, my wife wrote down both our names at Mrs. McNeill's request. Yet McNeill completely fabricated a conversation we allegedly had that Saturday morning. When I confronted him via email, he called and attempted to smooth over his lie. He revised the nonexistent conversation to another completely fabricated version. McNeill altered the caption (of my picture) and STILL got it wrong. After several phone calls and emails with me and my wife, he finally just left my name off the caption! Oh, I think maybe there were 2 pictures of planes in that M.A. District V report.
Interestingly, he never mentioned the winners in either class of the Fun Fly. Come to think of it, he never does. Maybe that's because he waltzes in early on the first day, breezes around long enough to be seen and be able to say "I attended..." He then leaves for the closest antique shops. At this particular event, the McNeills spent approximately an hour actually at the field.
Dr.1 Driver "There's a Hun in the sun!"
Fred, I feel that for me the pros to the AMA do not outweigh the cons and hence I am not a member. However, change might go a long way to encourage me and others like me to join once again. With that said though, I must caution you on making broad public assumptions as to what is or is not fact.
See my inserts below.
How do you know this is the case? How do you know the EC is simply not concerned with potential safety issues? Or perhaps much of this is a reaction, legit or not, to the terror threat and Homeland Defense issues?
Have you asked them?
I think the autonomous flight thing was something the AMA had no choice on. Much is being done in the UAV arena and among other things, what constitutes a model versus a UAV is being defined at levels higher than the AMA. Be thankful the Fed and the UAV industry is allowing the AMA participation in the matter. As evidenced by the fact that the AMA enacted the restriction. Next time you might want to ask the EC what was behind their actions.
His choice! So? But again, even though he started in Canada, didn't he practice and develope the system in the US? Maryland to be exact? And had the AMA enacted the restriction, then by definition the vehicle would no longer have been a model but would have been a UAV instead. Politics and semantics I know but a fact of life none the less.
Last I checked, there is nothing in the Smithsonian related to models of any kind other than static display. And that includes the new annex out by Dulles Airport. Been there, seen it! Wouldn't have been nice had the AMA contrubuted to the annex funds for a separate wing for flying models? Think of the PR they could have gained being tied to the worlds most visitied museum like that!
Said what? He's tired and retired? Or that DB and company got their hooks into him? I'm not surprised he's tired. The man is getting on in years. He's got to be one of the oldest living modelers around.
Again, have you asked them? Just this autonomous thing is to me one example where they're working for our interests instead of restricting them. So you can't fly R/C with an autopilot! Big deal!
Might beat being grounded! Ever think of that?
Again, how do you know? Or are these more of your assumptions? Have you ever dealt with the Federal Government? Other than the IRS that is? Not the easiest thing to work with and not smart enough IMHO to know the difference between a hobby and a threat. Especially when they're seeing UAV's being presented that are based on .60 size trainers, are smaller than anything you or I fly to include the Park Flyers, are man portable and, by the governments own admission, are being designed to carry weapons. Is it any wonder the ignorant government worker panics at the sight of a whole organization of potenital airial terrorits? We know we're not but, can we guarantee that everyone in our ranks is here just for hobby interests?
Then I suggest you move to France and enjoy!
And perhaps invest in a large, open structure so you can fly indoors!
But either way, consider what you say. You make some broad accusations here without evidence of having questioned all sides.
Chuck
What's wrong with antique shops Fred? Would you rather he was sitting next to you in the bars? Easier for you to find but not as coherent.
Again, can you PROVE it Red? Reading all this about McNeill I have no doubt he is certainly past his time if indeed he ever had a time. But, all I see here is conjecture, stories and rumors. Nothing has really been documented and assembled to make a real case. This suggests the whole thing is nothing but sour grapes between the antagonists (you, Fred, etc) and McNeill. And it makes me wonder what your motives might be.
You berate him for his antique hobby. Does everyone here do nothing but R/C? Doesn't anyone else hunt, fish, golf or whatever? What's wrong with antiques? And what an opportunity to be able to combine the two hobbies in such a way! However, if he does indeed spend very little time at R/C events versus the antique shops as many of you have suggested. Without some documented evidence you guys are simply blowing in the wind.
If you really want to take him to task, organize and DOCUMENT it. Car and license plate arrival and departure times. Video tape him arriving and leaving with the tape date time stamped. Video tape his conversations. Especially when the tough questions are asked. Follow him to the antique shops. Make notes!
Otherwise this all appears like you guys are just making a grab for some power for whatever reason. And are ion fact really no better or worse than McNeill. Just different!
Does this guy or his wife sell antiques for a living?
I wonder if he travels on the AMA dime and then writes the travel as his wife's antique sales business travel.
Otherwise, is he independently wealthy? In that case he could take some tax breaks related to charity work.
Barry
You must be one of his toadys.
No "if" to it. I've been in the AMA for 25 years, and in Dist. V for 20 of those years. I've always been active in attending Fly Ins, Fun Flys, and Giant Scale meets in Dist. V and Dist IV. I usually go to between 4 and 10 events per year. One year I got to 15! I've seen McNeill at a total of 2, that's right, TWO events in all that time. At both events he showed up early on the first day, stayed about an hour, then vanished. Now I know he can't attend every event in his District, but you'd think the law of probability would have allowed me to see him more than TWO TIMES in 25 YEARS!
No video tape needed. I've heard him in person. He is pathetically ignorant of anything concerning R/C or the current state of the art in ANY of the AMA categories or SIGs, INCLUDING his alleged area of interest, Free Flight.
It's people like you, with their blinders on, who keep getting McNeill re-elected. Or do YOU, as you've suggested about others, have some hidden agenda or self-serving interest in keeping McNeill in office? Dr.1 Driver "There's a Hun in the sun!"
"Dr1Driver" wrote: (about C. O. Jones)
Nah, Driver... C.O. doesn't have a political agenda. He's shown his true colors in this NG time and time again... he's just a blowhard who loves to boast, brag, and argue. Simple(minded) as that. He doesn't have a clue, just a keyboard. His apathy and arrogance is indicative of the problem in DV, however. I believe there's enough of us who can see McNeil for what he truly is to finally replace him this election. We can make the C.O.'s of this district even more insignificant.
Vote Stillman!
Jack
I try no to reply to much of the hate and dissention here. However it would seem to me that instead of jumping on the person asking a question that you could direct him in the right way. I for one have been reading this news group for a long time. I'm not a heavy poster but I am tired of people that constantly try to be-little others about one subject. I think this runs people away from the newsgroup. I don't know if you have noticed but there isn't near as many posts as there were a year ago. Where have all the good people gone? Kinda makes me go hummm. I'm really getting tired of reading all this stuff and am my self wondering why I come here. I want to read about airplanes. Please step back and look at what we are doing to ourselves here. Eddie Fulmer AMA
63713 CDWhooaa there. McNeill flys or at least used to fly scale free flight. Now I don't expect such a person to know every aspect of Radio Control, nor does that disqualify him. But I would expect more effort given to understand it.
All claims regarding McNeill have been documented. Timed stamped photos of arrival and departure times are on file. Copies of his letters threatening the opposition have been posted.
Now C.O. Jones - you wouldn't be Kevin Kline back again demanding "proof" of what is obvious to most AMA members that have taken time to examine the situation would you? Since you are not a member of the AMA or live in District V why are you even involved in this discussion in the first place? If you are not Kevin Kline you sure do a great imitation of his style.
Red S.
Now, see what you have here? I've been a member of AMA for many years and I am in District 1. Every year, I get the renewal notice and I read on it how you don't send the ballet to muncie, you send it somewhere else.
So, 4854 people of the District V membership can read and follow directions and 10,000 of them can't? If half the people in the district can't understand and follow directions, then how do you expect them to vote for the better person?
The 10,000 ballots missent to Muncie were a national vote - for President as well as several District VPs. But still your point is well taken...You just can't dump the whole blame on District V or specifically Florida that has had other problems associated with ballots in the past. :-)
I'll bet those 10,000 votes were all from Florida ;)
Kline's back? Where's my garlic necklace?: Dr.1 Driver "There's a Hun in the sun!"
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