Exactly but my friends in Europe have a real driver training school to
get their licenses. Like my analogy, take your average button pusher
give them Cimitron, MC, NX, or ... and the results are purely dependent
on the default outputs that day.
Btw, the newbie driver on the Autobahn will be needing the xanax if not
Bill, you get assemblies with Solidworks. I import full assemblies on
virtually every job. It puts each component on a different level, in
the order that you added them to the assembly in Solidworks. I'm
definitely not doing any "assembling" inside of Mastercam though!
How much is the maintenance and a nice machine-specific 5 axis post
When I open NX, my customers solid lives separately in a ready only
folder that is viewed in as a component. If a new model rev comes in, I
do a quick compare then point my part file to the new model. There is no
repositioning the part since it stays in the customers defined attitude.
You pay dearly if you accidentally machine a part to an old rev. <g>
File size is much smaller too. I just finished a 20' long support rib.
My counterpart at the clients did a similar part in NX where he brought
everything in as solids (he didn't know how to use assemblies). His part
file was 75 megs, mine was 24.
Not quite apples to oranges with NX as they include machine simulation
(Vericutish' looking models). They do include a bunch of posts only that
come with all the cam packages. In the 5ax packages, they provide
several complete post and machine simulations for running inside of NX.
Fanuc, Heidenhain, and Sinumerik controls are provided for them. I think
to buy a custom machine specific post with simulation it's about $8k. If
you buy a new machine, that would be the time to do it. If your just
using little Haas and Fadals maybe not worth it. You can get the post
only built for much less I'm sure since it's just modifying existing stuff.
Once you get the hang of simple Tcl language, they are pretty easy to
modify yourself using the included Postbuilder app. It's also pretty
easy to convert the existing machine sims to fit your needs if you know
how to model. The machine sims are just assembly models with kinematics
This is where software companies are lacking- profiting- gouging?.
Post's should be FREE if you buy the software. Is that a good selling
point? Buy me & get this free? Their just doing like you BillT says,
modifying a "standard". It aint a big deal. Ya there may be some
(limit it to say 3) go arounds for specific customer needs, but now
they have that one to lure & push on the next client?
Oh well, what do I know, I'm not in sales & marketing.
~ Gil ~
the self proclaimed IT13ฉฎ king
When I started at current job they didn't have a Mastercam post for a
Sharnoa Tiger 5. It cost $900 dollars to get one, they initially quoted
$1200. Then after finding out the hard way that arcs in the XZ and YZ
planes can only be programmed using polar coordinates, our VAR wanted to
charge another $900 for a post written to output code in polar
coordinates. I wish I was privy to the phone conversation my boss made
to them after he found that out as we did get that post free of charge.
Which begs a question I never asked here.
Are any CAM systems capable of switching between absolute and polar
positioning in the same posted program?
Ever wonder if taxation without representation might have been cheaper?
Back in the "day" Mscam & Cimatron came with a standard library of
posts. Scam had photo copied doc.s on how to modify it that I got from
our new VAR when he got all of the old "quicksilver" customers
combining into the "new" mastercam. WTF? is this. Oh ya were going to
do a total re-write from the ground up. It will be true 3D & very
powerfull! That was 90ish -ver4.1, still waiting......................
Cimatron came with an editor GPP program ($option$) to compile post's
it when done. I never learned it. I just worked / negotiated it out
with their post "guru" & he modified it for me. Wonder what ever
happened to Ogen Goldstein? Smart guy. Anyway I had a "white
elephant" Mistubishi V55 tool change sequence problem. If multiple
tools were used, it had to leave the spindle empty at the end of the
program with T99 listed- if not the MF'er would grab the wrong tool
next time around & also every toolchange had to be preceded with the
next tool prep. Sweet machine for doing moldbase work. 30hp. gear head
50taper. I turtle by today's standards, but you actually had time to
hit the E-Stop<g>
~ Gil ~
the self proclaimed IT13ฉฎ king
In NX if I needed to switch to polar (or any other oddity) for certain
operations I create a User Defined Event - meaning a special word that
when my post sees it, do the magic till another word tells it not to. In
the post I create an Event Handler that just like its name... handles
it. Not a big problem. I would think most posts have this type of
Oh man your reaching for the stars! How would that be selectable or
determinable whilst programming? Maybe a toggle within each toolpath?
2 posts - no problem
ah taxation w/o rep. is happening right now. It aint cheaper for us
but may not be the case with the special interest groups they do
Some people make things happen....
Some watch things happen...
While others complain it cant happen
I would say they give you a bunch of posts to start with. Most will
work. But the rub is some folks have some real anal habits when it
comes to how the posted code should look. And they will give you a
hundred reasons why it has to be that way. I have a post for a dead
simple 3ax Haas I did ten years ago that outputs subroutines for any
Z-level milling purely because that shop had Gibbs that output that way
had nothing to do with memory limits. Some want the Dx on the initial Z
rapid line, others like it at the G41/42. Some want a variable and not
literals for things like toolnos, feeds, and speeds - just in case...
Then things get a lot deeper when outputting the shop docs with the
post. NX does it quite well as does Mastercam. Currently, the new trend
is to output HTML docs but only a couple folks will accept them. NX will
output a complete shop book with snapshots of the part after each tool
has cut on a separate page with the tool descriptions and operator
messages captured. No one accepts that yet. They like Excel, so I'm
writing a macro to output to Excel to keep Microsoft in business. <g>
we have a mill that cuts moldbases. fanuc control.
It calls up the next tool right after the line it does the current tool
change on. Maybe it's pre positioning it in the carousel?
But in order to start in the program you mdi the tool you want first, then
run the program. Adding a tool call up right before the m6 line would solve
it. Quick fix.
!!!!! But don't change it, that's the way it was setup when installed,
there's prolly a reason? !!!
(shakes head...looks at feet...walks away)
yep its "tool prep"
g-code code has only T# on one line - the machine tool loads that
next code line is M6 T# (prep's/ stages next tool)
Put the tool code in both places in the post. That was my stupid
Vinny, we call it like this to minimize potential disasters:
Some machines with poorly written toolchange macros will alarm if you
have call "T13M06" after you've already staged T13.
On 2/20/2010 1:15 PM, Joe788 wrote:
Here's a blurb about the simulation tools:
I think that is where most cam packages are going hence my lengthy
avoidance of pricing just a post. <g>
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