Car lockout question

Go ahead & try it!

W/o the proper tools, there's a hell of a lot of damage that you can do.

Be prepared to be sued when you've done damage to the wiring, etc., on a Lexus, BMW or any other vehicle.

When we come up on a vehicle that the local PD or TTD has screwed up attempting to get in with the WRONG tools, we advise to sue them for damage & repairs.

Why do you think Locksmiths purchase the MANY tools & updates each year. I damn sure wouldn't if just a coat hanger would do the job.

Newnsie

As I've never been formally trained, do locksmithing schools actually have cars on site with the door panels removed for training? Do you guys go out in the lot and practice on your own cars?

It seems there are so many different cars out there, the training and literature must be pretty involved.

BTW, as for doing damage: I desperately tried to get a friend with a stalled BMW to call a tow truck, but he didn't want to spend the money. I refused to push him with my car, so he called someone else to help him. I think he learned his lesson when his other "friend" damaged the rear of his car to the tune of $2500. Often, what seems expensive at first turns out to be a bargain in the end.

Sheldon snipped-for-privacy@sopris.net

As I've never been formally trained, do locksmithing schools actually have cars on site with the door panels removed for training? Do you guys go out in the lot and practice on your own cars?

It seems there are so many different cars out there, the training and literature must be pretty involved.

BTW, as for doing damage: I desperately tried to get a friend with a stalled BMW to call a tow truck, but he didn't want to spend the money. I refused to push him with my car, so he called someone else to help him. I think he learned his lesson when his other "friend" damaged the rear of his car to the tune of $2500. Often, what seems expensive at first turns out to be a bargain in the end.

Sheldon snipped-for-privacy@sopris.net

As I've never been formally trained, do locksmithing schools actually have cars on site with the door panels removed for training? Do you guys go out in the lot and practice on your own cars?

It seems there are so many different cars out there, the training and literature must be pretty involved.

BTW, as for doing damage: I desperately tried to get a friend with a stalled BMW to call a tow truck, but he didn't want to spend the money. I refused to push him with my car, so he called someone else to help him. I think he learned his lesson when his other "friend" damaged the rear of his car to the tune of $2500. Often, what seems expensive at first turns out to be a bargain in the end.

Sheldon snipped-for-privacy@sopris.net

A lot of professionals will go to a junkyard to practice - and that's after spending a lot on books and tools and studying.

Some professionals do lock work for car dealers and so have an opportunity to see disassembled doors, etc.

The real bottom line is that for the last 20 or so years the car manufacturers have been making their doors harder and harder to open. Also they have been cramming the doors full of electric wiring/controls, etc. - and so it has been getting easier to harm something serious by messing around. I.e. disconnecting the lock linkage is far from the worst thing that can be done accidentally.

I don't consider telling them to sue good advice.

I would think the correct procedure would be to tell them to turn in a bill to whoever damaged the vehicle first, then if they wouldn't pay it take them to small claims court. If they just get a lawyer and sue them it would cost more than the repairs to the vehicle, in most cases. I would also think that you could get drawn into it to testify to the damage they caused since you were the one that noted the damage and advised them to sue the other company. That would ultimately cost you time & money.

I realize there are a lot of "if's and's & but's" so this is just my outlook on this.

Leon Rowell

UPUHRS5437 wrote:

Yes, this can work on certain models. The chances of damaging something are REALLY high. The chances of success (with or without damage) depend on the exact model and year, but in general are rather low. Modern cars use shielded linkages and shrouded bellcranks and such.

What makes the locksmith sucessful is 1) training; 2) a variety of tools and 3) books that list each model and how to open it. Yup. Each model, updated yearly.

Typical opening instructions include phrases like these: "Insert the 'Z' tool 12 and a half inches from the front of the passenger side door." "Twist the tool 90 degrees and move it back 4 inches." "Be carefull not to break the window." "Lift slowly being careful not to snag the"....

You are probably thinking right about now that there's no way to consistantly guess the right place and angles to stick a coat-hanger. In addition to snagging wires, you can also disconnect the lock's linkages, bend linkages and in general muck thinks up.

I managed to lock my self out of my car in Reno. It was a 1980s RX7. The tow truck driver who 'slim-jimed' the door bent the linkage and partially disconnected the lock from the linkage. I learned a bit about linkages and learned to carry a spare key in my wallet.

Daniel

Thanks for all the insightful answers. I've also learned my lesson the hard way, and now keep keys creatively hidden on both my cars. Trust me, if they get stolen it won't because somebody found the key.

Oh, yeah. The next time a damsel in distress asks me to help her, I'll let her find a locksmith in shining armor to assist.

Sheldon snipped-for-privacy@sopris.net

I went to several junk yards in the area to practice opening cars.

The City of Philadelphia is self insured & even a small attempt to find the proper agency to make an attempt to file a claim for reimbursement for damages is an attempt in futility!

You get shuffled from one department to another untull you get PO'd & forget it. That's what they want.

That's why I tell customers to sue. Most times the City settles. Now they tell the PD to attempt entry only in an emergency situation. ie: child inside, etc.

Newnsie

my small town would open ANYTHING, including houses... the Police Chief got 'replaced, and the NEW Chief made an immediate policy change... IF there is a baby or animal inside, THEN and ONLY THEN, will they open... Life Safety takes precedence... but, you locked yourself out and no 'danger to a life inside'? wont open. they got tired of paying out claims. --Shiva--

snip

A reasonable fear.

Most cars on the road today require special tools and/or techniques.

It's really easy to turn in a claim. All you have to do is send it registered mail to the city legal department. Davenport, Iowa is self insured and that is what I did when I hit a big chuck hole and broke the windshield in my van. Took pictures of the hole and my windshield with the date on them, & wrote them a nice note. They paid to have the windshield replaced and apologized for the inconvenience to me.... I don't know why it wouldn't work the same in any city.

Leon Rowell

UPUHRS5437 wrote:

Try that here in the "BIG" city & you'd be filing claims forever & forever!

Our city workers are the laziest, bar none. They just shuffle papers & get paid. They have no idea of how city Gvmt works as most are hacks politically appointed.

Since we started telling our clients to start suit, the PD has been instructed to only open vehs when a child is locked in.

How's you like to see your veh catch fire & start burning from inside, BEFORE the cop could remove the slim jim from the wiring he just cut & shorted?

The FD put out the dash fire, causing MORE damage than the cop did.

I had the lady start suit & the city settled.

Newnsie

First, let me say that I'm a professional locksmith who learned how to reprogram comptuers to fix machines where the owner had lost the disk. I've also been able to program some PDA and laptops for clients, but only when someone who I knew was in charge was present. My success rate has been pretty good, especially with windows, but programming did become kind of a hobby for me. I did try to help a neighbor once who was locked up, but we eventually had to call a computer guy. So, you're dealing with an ethical amateur who uses the craft/trade/art professionally, but knows when to call in a pro.

Anyway, here's my question: I read that you can reprogram a computer by bending a coat hanger and sliding it between the window and door, grabbing the disk drive and pulling up, much like using Slim Jim. Often, I will come across a damsel in distress who's had the blue screen and would love to help, but since I don't have the training I'm afraid I may damage something inside the drive doing this, which would cost far more than calling a computer guy.

So, does this really work? And does it work with today's modern computers? I can't believe they would go through all the trouble to make these high-tech disks if you can reprogram this easily. I've seen a pro do this, and it seems to me the only reason it works is that a pro knows what's inside the drive and has the proper tools. I don't, so I avoid helping people like the plague.

Hey, I'll make a deal with you. I'll stay out of computers if....

Hey, I spent 25 years learning this stuff and you want me to tell you how to reprogram a computer for Free! Get REAL! With all the computer guys out of work right now you should be calling a professional!

My other gut response was to write....

Make sure you stick the slim jim far enough back to snag that flat grey cable, then pull as hard as you can. This will fix all your Windows problems. The number of GPF errors per hour falls off drastically if you do follow this procesdure. On the other hand, you stand a 50/50 chance that you will release the Magic Smoke that allows all things electronic to function. Again, buying a new computer (complete with fresh Magic Smoke) will solve your Windows problems, at least until you power it on.

Daniel (with tongue firmly in cheek)

I hear you loud and clear, and enjoyed your analogy, but there's certainly nothing wrong with going into a computer newsgroup and asking if I do this or that will it solve my problem.

With all due respect to all professions, I'm heavily into DIY, but not to the point of stupidity. I'm sure you guys have gone out on a lot of calls where the price would have been far less if the person had not tried to do it themselves, and I see the same thing in my profession. Fortunately, it's not like brain surgery where a mistake will cost you more than money.

Hey, at least I asked the question BEFORE doing something stupid. Better that, then asking questions about how I tried to help a damsel in distress, and now her car is on fire, the electric windows won't go up and down, and the side airbag exploded.

Sheldon

Sigh. If this wasn't usenet, we could be friends.

Great reply.