Mosler safe combination

Contact Mosler. They will direct you appropriately. Tel.: +49 (0) 5 41 98 25 66 52 - Fax: +49 (0) 5 41 98 25 66 66 snipped-for-privacy@mosler-safe.com

or

Email snipped-for-privacy@lackasafe.com or call

Is it a "real" commercial safe, or a "toy" home safe? If the former, I'm sure a locksmith could rework the combination for you, if the later, they'll laugh at you for asking.

Is that the real mosler company, or a fake? Mosler went bankrupt in

Thanks

I will give them a try

It is called a class C safe, reportedly weighs 400 lbs, 30x21x54" tall.

I would think that it is somewhere in between.

Just be careful handling it, some of the fancier types have a plate of glass as part of the locking mechanism, if it gets shocked and broken, the locking bolts get driven outwards and you're cooked. Keeps the hammer and chisel types at bay.

Stan

I think Roger Shoaf is a locksmith. You might try sending him an email.

Most locksmiths are highly protective of any sort of information they have concerning opening locks. They will generally treat you as a thief unless they know you.

Yes, it is called a relocker. I think that this safe does not have one. I thought to convert it to a gun safe.

Well, I have a receipt for the safe and it is open.

But good point.

I would believe an open safe door is all the bonafides you will need.

Wes

-- "Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

Thanks, that is not so bad...

Ignoramus3982 wrote in news:Qb- dnd3SaJSvEKXQnZ2dnUVZ snipped-for-privacy@giganews.com:

I used to get safe style combination locks at the Los Alamos surplus yard when I was a kid. Some had been drilled when the combination was lost, but some were entact. These were ~ 1950's vintage. You could take the back cover off & figure out what the combination was. Most of them had a hole in the back where you could insert a special key. This would allow you to change the combination. I never had the magic key, or the time to figure out how to make one, but I examined quite a few such locks, and that was clearly the intent. I don't recall if any had a keylock in the dial, but I suspect the combination part is largely the same.

I also know many safe combinations can be changed without heroics from my long association with the MIT pistol range. They have a bunch of surplus safes, and whenever there has been a major change of personnel in the coach/range master position, the MIT locksmith came through & changed most of the combinations. Some of the safes are really ancient, and either are difficult to change, or require an oddball key/tool to do it, so they have remained unchanged for decades. They are typically used for ammo or airguns, with the better safes reserved for the firearms.

As long as it's in your truck, I would take it to a locksmith, because they usually charge more for housecalls. It would be worth checking around to find a really good one. There are a lot of folks claiming to be locksmiths who can't do much more than install locksets & cut keys.

Doug White

They're pretty easy to change out on mine--just remove rear cover and lift the rings off of the splined shaft, reposition them to the new combination and then re--assemble...

If the safe is open just take it on in to the locksmith shop. He should be able to work on the safe right on the back of your trailer and not only set up a combination for you but also check it over to see if there are any problems that could cause a lockout.

It is cheap to have the thing checked while open, but it can get expensive when you are locked out.

If you need me to I can find a good safe guy in your area, but any reputible company should be able to help you with this.

Also, the key in the dial is just to lock the dial for day lock purposes, the main lock is the combination lock. This feature is most often used in an office situation to avoid having to dial open the safe each time.

Roger Shoaf

I once had a girlfriend who had a 16-year-old kid, who locked his keys in his car. We called a locksmith, and stood around watching while he poked around the lock with his lockpick - we wanted to see how it was done. We were all chatting and stuff, watching and waiting for about five minutes or so; he finally said, "Gee, I guess this side is jammed or something - lemme try the other side. He walked to the other side of the car, squatted down, and had it open in about three seconds, before any of us even thought to follow him.

I guess he was also an off-duty cop. :-)

Cheers! Rich

I:

alt.locksmiting has a number of informed people on it. Explain your circumstances and legitimacy as you did here and you'll do well. If you want more, search the archives as your question wouild not be unprecedented.

Regards,

Edward Hennessey

Yes. (If you have a combination which can open it at least, or got it unlocked.)

Just to try to figure the period from which it comes, Is the combination dial about 3" diameter, numbers on the side rather than the face, with a knob which is about half that diameter sticking out something like 3/4" or 1" from the body of the dial? It it fairly metal colored, with a black dot in the middle of the knob about 2/3 the diameter of the knob? If so, it is from the same period as the ones on the security file cabinets which I used to deal with at work. Oh yes, does the dial read from 0 to 99?

The first thing is to get the combination open -- or if it is already open, *don't* close it. (You can experiment with the door open, the the worst problem likely to be that you will lock it open.

Anyway -- new from the factory, these come with a combination which I may have backwards so I'll give it both ways. It starts CCW, with each subsequent number reversing the previous direction. There are three significant digits, plus a final stop on zero. (This stopping point can be changed on some, but I've always seen them left standard.)

The combination is either 25-50-25-0 or 50-25-50-0. Crank it CCW until the first number has passed the index at least three times and stop on the forth or more (it does not hurt anything but your patience to turn more times for this first number.) Then turn it CW until the number you have just set hits the index two times and then go to the next number (*don't* overshoot, or you will have to start over). Then turn CCW again until you have reached the number just dialed once and go to the next number. Finally, turn CW again and stop at zero. After this, the handle should allow it to be unlocked.

If whoever got rid of this did not lock it open, or reset it to the factory combination, then you will *really* need the locksmith to open it, and then repair it. Typically, the critical places for drilling a lock of this sort open are covered with concrete filled with old carbide inserts -- designed to destroy your drill. :-) The locks are also designed so if you cut off the dial and drive the shaft through, you will lock the lock *forever* -- nothing you can do will allow it to be opened -- other than cutting your way into the safe and removing the lock. :-)

There will be access behind it -- usually with a door of some sort and several thick (1/4" or so) pieces of steel blocking access to it. You lift these out, and then remove the four screws which hold the lock together. The backplate will come out with a stack of three black plastic discs on it with a rectangular notch on the edge of each disc. Each of these discs have a hub which pops out, and a pointer so the hub and the disc can be set to any number from 0 to 99.

You set the combination by changing each hub pointer to set the desired number. IIRC, the disc closest to the knob is the first number, and the other two are in sequence following that. If you want to change the final zero, take the knob out (requires a bit more work on the body of the lock) and check for a 100-point spline connecting the shaft to the back of the dial. I've seen this on some Sargent & Greenleaf security file cabinet locks, but I don't know whether it is present on the Mosler locks. (The S&G knobs have a thumb tab in the center of the knob which has to be rotated to engage the part which draws back the bolt -- and it is possible that one may have been fitted to the Mosler safe at some point. These locks don't have to be disassembled to reset them. There is a special keyhole in the back. You dial the old combination, install the key and rotate it 90 degrees, then dial the desired new combination using a second index mark a bit CCW from the normal one. Once the new combination is dialed, return the key to the proper position, and withdraw it.

After changing the combination, try to work the lock at least twice to make sure that you can open it *** before *** you close the safe.

Is it open? Are you *sure*. If it isn't open, do you have a combination for it? If not, expect a lot of work on somebody's part.

How big is it? One of the little cubes used for normal valuables, or a gun safe or something of the sort?

Do you want to let the locksmith set the combination, or do you want to do it yourself? My own preference is to do it myself, so I know that nobody else has the combination. (Well -- at work, the combinations were changed about every six months, and the new combinations were written on a special card, sealed in a special envelope, and locked in the safe of the next level of management up. (They *really* don't want to have to drill a safe open. :-) It all depends on how valuable the contents will be -- and whether you want someone else to be able to open it after you die.

You might get the locksmith to set a combination for you that you know you can use to open it later, and then set it yourself later. If it has a S&G lock fitted, see if he can sell you the key to allow combination changes. They usually come packaged with each new lock.

Here is an open view of the S&G locks which I was familiar with:

Hmm ... looks as though Mosler now has some with the S&G type of resetting key.

Good Luck, DoN.

The basics of the key are a shaft which is square (to match the square at the keyhole), with a turned down tip to act as a bearing, another turned down section to act as a bearing in the square hole, and a flange off one of the corners which is milled off the part which goes inside the lock - other than a short piece which just passes through the keyhole and prevents withdrawing the key while it is turned. The end view looks sort of like this:

/\ / \----- \ /----- \/

Allowing for the inability to draw a true square with ASCII graphics. :-)

Enjoy, DoN.

This is how it looks

On most vehicles you don't mess with the lock cylinder at all. On my old truck I can break into it (without damage) in 35 seconds - pathetic for a pro, but not bad for an amateur. I haven't tried it on my new truck, since it has a keypad so I can't lock myself out.