OT-: CAN YOU NAME THIS COUNTRY?

Just 200 days after the Clinton Gore Team left office these "tools" were needed. Thanks for the superior insight Bill, Hillary and AlGore. If they had just got rid of Bin Laden and left the tools in place how different it would be today. No 911, go figure. Michael

G

If they were eliminated and the US still had enough military to fight a war in Afghanistan and Iraq, the republicans must have done a very expensive job of pork barreling with excess military spending in the eighties.

John

The force reduction was proposed under Regan, authorized by a Republican controlled congress, started under Bush I and as they came into office Bush II and Rumsfeld fully intending to make even more cuts. Even now they are making plans for the next round of BRAC commission base closings.

So forget try>

So you are saying credit for the graet revenue surplus should have gone to Reagan? Right?

Michael

Either you are totaly ignorant of what has been happening over the past

20 years or you are just trying to spout the usual right wing crap.

Regan ran up the largest annual deficits in the history of the country. Bush I was forced to admit that fact and had to swallow his own words about no new taxes. Clinton presided over the largest non-military reduction of government spending in the history of the country and now Bush II is well on the way to setting a new record in deficit spending.

Go back to your privy and read the newspaper BEFORE you wipe anything with it.

Must be catching....I just farted too.

Fred

When are going to actually reduce the federal debt... instead of moving it around with phoney numbers and supluses?

Small symbolics surpluses do not deal with the natioin's debt.. or debt obligations that will become very real in the next ten years through social security... or the fact that 50 percent of the cost of militery personal is not used for retirement of past militery members..

We get more and more in debt.. we get less and less from our governemnt.. we get a token suplus that is meaninless except for political exploitation... and as the band plays on.. debt increases... this does not inlcuded hidden and future debt...

The Debt To the Penny Current Amount

05/27/2004 $7,191,386,807,146.67

Current Month

05/26/2004 $7,193,954,083,326.45 05/25/2004 $7,197,503,931,787.58 05/24/2004 $7,193,240,510,846.79 05/21/2004 $7,191,790,812,520.17 05/20/2004 $7,191,321,725,950.37 05/19/2004 $7,179,680,898,792.06 05/18/2004 $7,183,392,668,476.95 05/17/2004 $7,175,792,737,791.70 05/14/2004 $7,148,485,831,875.31 05/13/2004 $7,147,545,929,573.40 05/12/2004 $7,138,336,407,027.29 05/11/2004 $7,140,938,564,371.73 05/10/2004 $7,136,491,126,797.91 05/07/2004 $7,131,316,785,832.04 05/06/2004 $7,133,629,790,637.80 05/05/2004 $7,127,985,763,866.20 05/04/2004 $7,124,773,711,006.15 05/03/2004 $7,105,796,969,042.55

Prior Months

04/30/2004 $7,133,789,490,581.43 03/31/2004 $7,131,067,950,647.32 02/27/2004 $7,091,943,110,094.84 01/30/2004 $7,009,234,605,728.06 12/31/2003 $7,001,312,247,818.28 11/28/2003 $6,925,065,499,881.34 10/31/2003 $6,872,675,839,106.67

Prior Fiscal Years

09/30/2003 $6,783,231,062,743.62 09/30/2002 $6,228,235,965,597.16 09/28/2001 $5,807,463,412,200.06 09/29/2000 $5,674,178,209,886.86 09/30/1999 $5,656,270,901,615.43 09/30/1998 $5,526,193,008,897.62 09/30/1997 $5,413,146,011,397.34 09/30/1996 $5,224,810,939,135.73 09/29/1995 $4,973,982,900,709.39 09/30/1994 $4,692,749,910,013.32 09/30/1993 $4,411,488,883,139.38 09/30/1992 $4,064,620,655,521.66 09/30/1991 $3,665,303,351,697.03 09/28/1990 $3,233,313,451,777.25 09/29/1989 $2,857,430,960,187.32 09/30/1988 $2,602,337,712,041.16 09/30/1987 $2,350,276,890,953.00

09/30/2000 $5,674,178,209,886.86

09/30/1999 5,656,270,901,615.43 09/30/1998 5,526,193,008,897.62 09/30/1997 5,413,146,011,397.34 09/30/1996 5,224,810,939,135.73 09/29/1995 4,973,982,900,709.39 09/30/1994 4,692,749,910,013.32 09/30/1993 4,411,488,883,139.38 09/30/1992 4,064,620,655,521.66 09/30/1991 3,665,303,351,697.03

--------------------------------------------------------

09/28/1990 3,233,313,451,777.25 09/29/1989 2,857,430,960,187.32 09/30/1988 2,602,337,712,041.16 09/30/1987 2,350,276,890,953.00 09/30/1986 2,125,302,616,658.42 12/31/1985 1,945,941,616,459.88 12/31/1984 1,662,966,000,000.00 * 12/31/1983 1,410,702,000,000.00 * 12/31/1982 1,197,073,000,000.00 * 12/31/1981 1,028,729,000,000.00 *

----------------------------------------------------------

12/31/1980 930,210,000,000.00 * 12/31/1979 845,116,000,000.00 * 12/29/1978 789,207,000,000.00 * 12/30/1977 718,943,000,000.00 * 12/31/1976 653,544,000,000.00 * 12/31/1975 576,649,000,000.00 * 12/31/1974 492,665,000,000.00 * 12/31/1973 469,898,039,554.70 12/29/1972 449,298,066,119.00 12/31/1971 424,130,961,959.95 12/31/1970 389,158,403,690.26 12/31/1969 368,225,581,254.41 12/31/1968 358,028,625,002.91 12/29/1967 344,663,009,745.18 12/30/1966 329,319,249,366.68 12/31/1965 320,904,110,042.04 12/31/1964 317,940,472,718.38 12/31/1963 309,346,845,059.17 12/31/1962 303,470,080,489.27 12/29/1961 296,168,761,214.92 12/30/1960 290,216,815,241.68 12/31/1959 290,797,771,717.63 12/31/1958 282,922,423,583.87 12/31/1957 274,897,784,290.72 12/31/1956 276,627,527,996.11 12/30/1955 280,768,553,188.96 12/31/1954 278,749,814,391.33 12/31/1953 275,168,120,129.39 06/30/1953 266,071,061,638.57 06/30/1952 259,105,178,785.43 06/29/1951 255,221,976,814.93 06/30/1950 257,357,352,351.04

If it were all that simple. 1+1=2

On Sat, 29 May 2004 18:42:52 GMT, Michael stated wide-eyed, with arms akimbo:

IF we hadn't created all those idiots in the first place, there would be no need for carrying the level of military we have now. WE played games in Iran until they turned on us, then WE put Hussein in power and our CIA trained all sorts of terrorists (and continues to TODAY, damnit), etc, etc, etc. ad nauseum. WE trained Kadafi, Hussein, bin Laden, etc. and all their terrorist minions. WE shit in our own messkit, as Gunner put it, and see what it got us? Feh!

- Yea, though I walk through the valley of Minwax, I shall stain no Cherry.

On Sat, 29 May 2004 16:13:05 -0400, Glenn Ashmore stated wide-eyed, with arms akimbo:

-snip-

Thanks to the Perot-spurred, Republican-led congress.

Oops, thanks to the Republican-led congress...

WTF for? All it contains is rep/dem posturing: Birdcage lining!

I hope nobody votes for a Rep or Dem in November. Wouldn't CHANGE for the better be a nice thing to wake up to?

- Yea, though I walk through the valley of Minwax, I shall stain no Cherry.

bin Laden is maggot food in a collapsed cave. Unless you know exactly which collapsed cave, among thousands at Tora Bora..only God could lay hands on him.

Gunner

That rifle hanging on the wall of the working-class flat or labourer's cottage is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there. - George Orwell

. Unless you know exactly

I guess if you only think your god, it doesn't count.

John

Huh?

Gunner

That rifle hanging on the wall of the working-class flat or labourer's cottage is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there. - George Orwell

Just because I'm curious, Gunner, why did you include the nuclear weapons stuff in that list? Do you think we need nuclear weapons to combat terrorism? Do you think that, after the reductions, we now have too few nukes to do whatever it is we're supposed to do with them?

Carl Sagan once wrote about the nuclear arms race between the US and the USSR, and described the situation as being essentially identical to two angry little boys standing in a closed room. The room is full of gasoline. The boys are up to their knees in it. And each boy has a thousand books of matches. Does it really - REALLY? - worry you if we "disarm" just a bit, and decide to try living with only 800 books of matches?

KG

||The force reduction was proposed under Regan, authorized by a Republican ||controlled congress, started under Bush I and as they came into office ||Bush II and Rumsfeld fully intending to make even more cuts. Even now ||they are making plans for the next round of BRAC commission base closings. || ||So forget trying to pin it on Clinton. All he did was not interfere with ||a process instigated by Republicans. Look to your own if you want to ||blame someone.

No blame neccessary. It's part of a long-range plan to make our military more of a technical force, rather than throwing a lot of men at a problem. The last few conflicts have borne out that policy, as we have defeated numerically superior, but lower-tech armies with relatively little loss of US lives. We have a much smaller army that is much more potent - higher mobility, more firepower, more tactical information to the foot soldier. Texas Parts Guy

Hint Kirk..I posted something from another source without comment. I neither changed nor added to the article. I posted it for discussion, which it has generated. Other than that..shrug.. Though its true that I do consider the military cuts of the 70s to have been horrible, and the Humint resources cuts of the Clinton administration to have been unforgivable.. The High Tech GeeWhiz kids tried to promote their versions of observation and detection, and shut out all human based intel..gutted the programs. Which is a component of why we have done so poor in ending the various individual cells of people with bad intentions to the US and our allies. At one time it was put forwards that we should not hire, or form alliences with bad people, even if they were enemies of our enemies. Serious mistake. Shrug.

So..how much of a threat to the world is the USSR nowdays? Other than as an environmental disaster....

Seems like we won the arms race, no? And the world didnt go up in radioactive fireballs.

Gunner

That rifle hanging on the wall of the working-class flat or labourer's cottage is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there. - George Orwell

|| Do you think we need nuclear weapons to ||combat terrorism?

I wish I had a nickel for every time I have heard that recommended. Texas Parts Guy

The problem is, once the initial invasion shock has worn off, now we have the manpower intensive job of occupying the nations we invaded, but we're coming up short on the manpower to do a proper job of it.

Gary