Splines?

If you plan on controlling the wheel motors with regular spool valves like are normally used on double acting cylinders, be sure to use a size larger than the lines you will be connecting to it. Spool valves have pretty convoluted flow paths and add a lot of resistance / friction, particularly when you are "feathering" the controls which will heat your hydraulic fluid. Going a size larger will help limit the heating, but you should still have a hydraulic oil cooler in the system. Most commercial equipment uses hydrostatic pumps (one per wheel motor) which provide a variable flow in both forward and reverse to drive the wheel motors so they don't have the heating problems you'll have with spool valves. Put a hydraulic fluid temp gauge on your dash somewhere so you can see if you're pushing the machine too hard.

Pete C.

Reply to
Pete C.
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The hydraulic motor has a GPM flow rating of 60. I have a Husco 3 spool valve rated @ 40 GPM I am thinking about using in a closed center configuration. Not quite matched but I think the flow might be adequate for the speeds I intend to operate this machine at -- about 7 miles per hour max I would think. Of course I would still have to look at the circuit closer once I figure out the specs on the Sunstrand pump. Upon closer visual examination of the pump, I was mistaken in stating that the two hydraulic hoses originating from the control valves piggybacked on the pump connect to the small gear pump at the tail. In fact, those hoses communicate with ports at the lower portion of the piston pump close to the base. Some sort of control for the swash plate of the piston pump I'm thinkin'. If tha'ts the case, then the small gear pump can probably be used to run my double action cylinders therefore simplifying the circuitry into two separate systems, main pump for the drive in a closed center configuration as suggested previously, and the gear pump for the cylinders in an open center type control. Your suggestions on the sizing of the control valves and cooling for the fluid are highly valid and appreciated, they will be incorporated in the final design.

With reguard to the power source, depending on the GPM flow of the pump, your point on the use of a transmission intermediate to the pump may be necessary indeed. If the pump flows 40 GPM, a guesstimate on my part, my engine would have output at least 80 HP at 1800 RPM roughly, allowing for inefficiencies. I have the formula somewhere but have not done the calculations on that yet. Can my 283 CI V-8 engine meet this need, I'd have to just try and go at it, dyno testing is out of the question on this low budget project. If not, I'd have to use a transmission to obtain gear reduction.

As to the size of this skid steer project, poster Richard W. was curious. My concept in this home built low budget skid steer assembled with less expensive surplus equipment is as follows:

Compact build out of structural steel, built stout. It has to be maneuverable in my small residential yard.

4 wheel skid steer steering linking two independently controlled wheel motors to their respective rear wheel partner via # 60 or # 80 chain and sprocket drive. I'm still entertaining the idea of 4 wheel steering but that complicates the steering system considerably. The wheels are off of a Gehl skid steer, the nicest aquisition of mine thus far as fas as value.

The loader scoop sized to carry at least 1/2 cubic yard of dirt comfortably. That would that be, roughly 800 lbs. I would think? A little too ambitious?

Stabilizers on the backhoe end 5' long per corner, angle of support adjustable anteriorly and laterally at reasonable effective ranges.

Capable of digging to 5' depth using the backhoe attachment.

Weight? Who knows!

As you can see, I continue to define the parameters of this project and establish the specifics as I go along. This is an exercise in shadetree engineering to be used only by me at my residence in non-mission critical applications. Of course I would like to incorporate the best ideas I can come up with as well as constructive contributions from people like you folks. This is a learning experience I've been excited about for a long time and the process I've undergone so far has already been highly rewarding to my psyche. Thank you for your time and keep the ideas and constructive comments comming!

Reply to
trg-s338

Sounds like a fun project. Just remember that the engineering on the fly works well on everything but hydraulic pumps. It's far too easy to destroy an expensive pump if you're not careful.

Pete C.

Reply to
Pete C.

Don't Chevy make these spline adapters ? I think they're called "transmission input shafts" - get down the scrapyard!

Reply to
Andy Dingley

Go to a bearing supply, farm supply, or industrial supply place and ask about splined adaptors. Number of teeth and Diameter are the minimum information you will need.

Cheers Trevor Jones

Reply to
Trevor Jones

This has been a very informative thread, lots of good input for a very interesting project.

If I were to try to improvise an internal spline, I think I'd try to drill a pattern of holes in a circle, that would engage the sides of the male splines. Cutting out the center hole to leave just a slight clearance or slip fit might suffice. This would still be a crude sort of coupler, and may not be anywhere near suitable for your pump application. A proper drive coupler would probably be hardened.

There are many archived RCM posts concerning the lathe method of broaching a keyway into the side of a hole. The lathe method would get a little complex for trying to index the part to form splines. Using essentially the same procedure, a vertical mill quill stroke could be utilized with a rotary table taking care of the indexing problem, if the mill has the capability of locking the spindle (or an improvised lock method).

Something else to consider is whether the pump housing is designed in a way to fully support it's input shaft. Many pump mounting applications may be dependent upon a bearing-supported drive component. The example of a pump coupled to a crankshaft utilizes the fully bearing-supported crankshaft, eliminating any chances of side loads being applied to the pump input shaft. Similarly, pumps that mount to engine castings will be driven by a bearing-supported drive component.

Another point I was pondering is that a 283 engine might be very valuable nowadays to car restorers. I don't remember when production stopped for the 283, but it might've been in the early 60's. It's predecessor, the 265, was a fairly short-lived engine size, as I recall. The 283 would provide some weight, unlike a more recent engine.

I think the starter motor mounts to the bell housing on those engines (kinda fuzzy memory at this point).. so if you're intending to use the bell housing, you'll have a well centered hole for a fairly precise mounting location. If you scrounge an old transmission, I think the input shaft nosepiece is a separate removable part that might be handy for getting your alignment locations properly set up.

As Andy D recommended, the best adapter to the clutch hub would be the trans input shaft. Old garages used to have lots of these laying around to align clutch plates during repairs. You can probably locate a precision bearing assembly to replace the original bush-type bearing that fits in the crank end cavity. I recall seeing many different input shafts, and the first internal gear is about 3-4x the diameter of the shaft, so machining this larger diameter to accept a pump coupler might not be too difficult.

I believe I've heard that a full yard of dirt is generally considered to be 1 ton.

WB ............

trg-s338 wrote:

Reply to
Wild Bill

I cut an internal spline (13) on my lathe . Printed out a pattern . Drilled out as much as I could . Bored the center and then stroked the lathe . Took me 8 hours and ended up with a hand full of blisters . In the end the part worked great so I guess a winner but not something I would do again unless I had to . Ken Cutt

Reply to
Ken Cutt

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