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http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,480984,00.html

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about friggin time!
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Tater
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snipped-for-privacy@aol.com says...

That would be the ones. Where will all those birds live in Huntsville if they take away their big birdhouse?
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Kurt Kesler



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<< That would be the ones. Where will all those birds live in Huntsville if they take away their big birdhouse? >>
Man, those old display Saturns have been sitting around for 40 years, in some cases out in the weather. Who would trust them in actual use??
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Chickens!
Randy
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Hippiestew wrote:

No spares in storage. The left-overs from Apollo and AAP are the lawn ornaments (and are *badly* decayed). There may be some 1B parts here and there, but none have been stored in a state that they could be used, even after refurbishment.
Brett
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wrote:

I wonder about the one at the Saturn center at KSC. It was supposed to be Apollo 19. I saw it last month, and I was amazed at how clean it was. I also about wet myself at its sheer size. Ever since I was a kid, I knew the Saturn V was big, but I didn't think it was *that* big!
<g>
Also, I noted that the SA-209 also on display there, which was supposedly the Skylab "rescue vehicle", had covers over the H-1 motors. Why bother if it's just a lawn ornament?
tah
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No but since most of the drawings have been lost perhaps they could duplicate it piece by piece and replace the computer with a PowerPC G5 running the entire infobus.
:)
Jerry
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Jerry Irvine wrote:

The drawings aren't really lost. That's not the problem, nor is the big problem the computer system - the computing requirements are quite minimal, and having a lot of computer doesn't really help at all. Besides, I doubt a G5 processor would have much chance of taking a hit like the Apollo 12 lightning strikes and just keep running. They were heavy, but those old crude IC's and discrete parts computers could really take a licking and keep on ticking.
The big problem is when you look on the drawing, it says stuff like "Allied-Signal Hydraulic pump, part #xxxxxx". But the contractor has been out of the pump business for 30 years or so. So now, you have to get another pump, or more likely, put out a proposal for one that can meet the original requirements, and then requalify it and set up a maunfacturing facility. Repeat 25000 times (for every part that you need but can't get), and you have run through a couple billion dollars do build a 40-year-old design.
The basic design of OSP might end up looking like an Apollo capsule from the outside, but the details will be completely different, and that's where the rubber meets the road. An it makes no sense to ressurect something that looks like a Saturn 1b (expensive even at the time, compared to similar vehicles like the Titan 3 series) when you can come up with a Delta IV "Extra Heavy" using parts that are still in production, well understood, and at minimal developmental costs.
Brett
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wrote:

can you point me to where they are?

*IF* you went through the same old design part by part. would be easier if one just said "ok, stage X gave XYZ specifications, lets see what matches up nowadays" bet we make it lighter, faster, stronger with more payload capability.
lemme know where them drawing are, our clubs got a couple of fanatics that would want to try tearing into them
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tater schuld wrote:

Which winds up being a partially new machine using Delta IV or Atlas V parts, and with no resemblance to the original. Which was, in fact, the point of my post.
If you want a Saturn 1b capabilities, but not the actual item, then you already have it - Titan IVb. Shuttle-C was approaching Saturn V capabilites (to LEO, anyway). Today, I would be tempted to cluster Delta IV first stages.
This is a much more practical approach than attempting to remake or refurbish a Saturn V.
Brett
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If the ATF situation goes to crap we can all just start building Saturn V's. FULL SCALE.
Nice hobby :)
Jerry
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Jerry Irvine, Box 1242, Claremont, California 91711 USA
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How dilusional are you?
Jerry
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Jerry Irvine wrote:

Good point ...
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It is not rue that the Apollo drawings are lost. Back for the 30th anniversary in 1999 they were all located: on microfiche under Peter Alway's bed :-)
    Bob Kaplow    NAR # 18L    TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD"         >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD! <<< Kaplow Klips & Baffle:    http://nira-rocketry.org/LeadingEdge/Phantom4000.pdf www.encompasserve.org/~kaplow_r/ www.nira-rocketry.org www.nar.org
Save Model Rocketry from the HSA! http://www.space-rockets.com/congress.html
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Bob Kaplow wrote:

Bob, that's not true at all.
Everybody know's Peter has the full-size drawings rolled up under his bed...
David Erbas-White
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Sigh...I'd run upstairs right now and look under my bed, but I can't. It's a a water bed supported by a box structure that has been sealed since the summer of 1990.
When we replace the bed, I'll let everyone know if I find a full set of Saturn V blueprints.
By the way, rocketeers are welcome to stop by to use my archives in Ann Arbor. I've got 20 linear shelf feet of 3-ring binders full of useless crap and occasional gems.
Peter Alway
Saturn Press PO Box 3709 Ann Arbor, MI 48106-3709 http://members.aol.com/satrnpress/saturn.htm Free scale data at: http://yellowjacketsystems.com/alway/Default.htm
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(PeteAlway) writes:

Are you saying all the blueprints are water stained? The first signal we had that led to the replacement of our old water bed was some rust stains o the sheets...

Neener! Neener! Neener! I've got more useless crap than you do!
    Bob Kaplow    NAR # 18L    TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD"         >>> To reply, remove the TRABoD! <<< Kaplow Klips & Baffle:    http://nira-rocketry.org/LeadingEdge/Phantom4000.pdf www.encompasserve.org/~kaplow_r/ www.nira-rocketry.org www.nar.org
Save Model Rocketry from the HSA! http://www.space-rockets.com/congress.html
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Bob Kaplow wrote:

Neener back to you! My shelf feet are logarithmic!
David Erbas-White
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ROAD TRIP!!!
Zak, bring the porta-scanner and yer laptop
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Tater
President of MARS Club
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