Zero Tolerance gone crazy

tdstr wrote:


I wasn't being "combative", I just think it's an annoyingly stupid quote.
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snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

Whatever Ray....whatever.
Ted Novak TRA#5512 IEAS#75
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Bob Kaplow wrote:

I can't find the exact quote you are refering to but here are a few that come close...
Older men declare war. But it is youth that must fight and die. -- Herbert Clark Hoover
I hate those men who would send into war youth to fight and die for them; the pride and cowardice of those old men, making their wars that boys must die. -- Mary Roberts Rinehart
I'm fed up to the ears with old men dreaming up wars for young men to die in. -- George McGovern
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But is it illegal to WISH you could kill the president? That is very different than actually making a threat.

I'm even less happy with laws that make it illegal for me to do something because of how someone else MIGHT abuse what I use in my activity. That should be unconstitutional. in fact, it *IS* unconstitutional, as it interferes with my "pursuit of happiness..."
--
Bob Kaplow NAR # 18L >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)! <<<
Kaplow Klips & Baffle: http://nira-rocketry.org/Document/MayJun00.pdf
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snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

We also live in a country where "vigilante justice" is a big pop fantasy.
And taking out unpopular world leaders is up there with that.
DGH
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doug holverson wrote:

Yep. Hollywood even turned the Revolutionary War into just another personal revenge movie ("Patriot").
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David wrote:

If you can twist that response into a death threat, you need to check yourself into a mental institution.
TK
--
Cogito ergo bibo

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If you really think this because someone's opinion or interpretation differs from yours, he is not the one who needs to be institutionalized.
--
Tweak

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If you believe that someone who believes that someone needs to be institutionalized for twisting a fictional hypothetical situation into a death threat needs to be institutionalized, then you need to be institutionalized, and anyone who disagrees with that needs to be institutionalized too, plus anybody who responds to this message, so neener-neener.
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Tweak wrote:

Okay, how about remedial English 090?
If <hypothetical situation> then <hypothetical action> # Declaration of intent to perform <hypothetical action> in the real world.
Are you with me so far?
Is there actually any other -rational- way to interpret it? If so, please illuminate me.
TK
--
Cogito ergo bibo

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TDKozan wrote:

Because you're dealing with the mentality of teenagers -- and every time we have one of the 'Columbine' things (or more recently, the murder of Daniel Horowitz' wife by a 16-year-old 'goth'), we keep asking "why didn't someone recognize the SIGNS???"
Erego, as a matter of policy, such threats against the president are taken seriously (as in investigated and a determination of their seriousness made). It's the same thing as saying 'bomb' in an airplane, or do you not understand that one either?
David Erbas-White
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David Erbas-White wrote:

Um, because the "signs" are being interpreted subjectively and capriciously.
Ergo, and as a matter of policy, perhaps there ought to be an objective threat against the President, or anyone else for that matter, before you make an arrest. Sadly, I do understand that it is the same thing today as saying 'bomb' in an airplane. I understand the difference between saying 'bomb' and saying 'I have a bomb' as well, and I mourn the loss of good sense that has made the former probable cause for arrest and harassment.
But hey! If it only saves one life. . . Bah. If it only saved one life I might get behind it. What I can't get behind is saving only one set of hurt feelings and catering to irrational fears.
TK
--
Cogito ergo bibo

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snipped-for-privacy@charter.net wrote:

Code of conduct? Does the code spec lying in response to questions from teachers?
Granted, she's a clueless bint but punishing her for giving an honest answer to a question is the act of a coward.
TK
--
Cogito ergo bibo

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snip
The code of conduct applies to the students and is fully explained at the beginning of the school year, every year, in detail that a moron and their parents can understand. It was nothing new to either. The girl fully understood that she would get the reaction she got from the administration, which at the very least would be expulsion. She got what she wanted.
It is a well known fact here that if you want out of school all you have to do is imply a threat and you're gone.
Randy www.vernarockets.com
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snipped-for-privacy@charter.net wrote:

Without exception zero tolerance ends up resulting in zero rational thought on the part of those set to administer the policy. What a waste for everyone involved.
Sorry, your "well known fact" scares the daylights out of me. I guess my last word on the subject will be that if your code of conduct is so subjective that someone can read a threat into the gal's writing and successfully expell and prosecute her for it, I'm glad as hell that I can still afford to send my son to a private school that rewards critical thinking and creativity in both the staff and the students.
Cheers,
TK
--
Cogito ergo bibo

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TDKozan wrote:

I'm sorry, just where did you see that they have "successfully expelled" or even "prosecuted" her?
She was arrested. There will be a hearing today. The result of the hearing is unknown (since it hasn't occurred yet). There is not a single word that I could find in that article about her being expelled. Frankly, I would be horrified if she WASN'T at least suspended for some period of time.
I am also 100% against zero-tolerance -- but that's not what was applied in this case (if you read the article and the circumstances). I am 100% against what you appear to be preaching, which is "100% acceptance", where no matter WHAT someone does in a school they're just being 'creative' or 'thinking critically'.
David Erbas-White
P.S. I would point out that when the girl was asked why she did it, the response wasn't anything along the lines of "I was attempting to provoke thought in my civics class by providing an exaggerated, satirical, modern 'modest proposal'", it was more along the lines of "I dunno". That strikes me as closer to John Hinckley than Jonathan Swift.
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David Erbas-White wrote:

folded in the first place. As I remarked earlier, she's a clueless piece of work.
Calling me a fan of 100% acceptance is kind of a reach. I will, however, accept 100% of anything that is legal and doesn't actually harm someone else (this does not include shattered sensibilities or hurt feelings however). It doesn't have to be in good taste or even especially smart. This is the U.S. It's our $Diety given right to be flaming idiots as you and I are proving now with our respective exaggerations to make our points.
TK
--
Cogito ergo bibo

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    Is this the rec.models.rockets forum or the alt.politics forum.
aeroforce100
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Pete wrote:
<snip>

Uh, yes.
TK
--
Cogito ergo bibo

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TDKozan wrote:

Of course, if the bullies, jocks, populars, normals, etc. threaten an uncool, you can be almost certain that teacher's eye will be conveniently blind.
Of course the other way around, you get your Zero Tolerance.
DGH
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