Discharge of water near waterline on ship models

I've noticed on many models of ships underway the modeler has included water
discharge streams from holes just above the waterline, and even remember a
judge commenting on omitting this detail on a ship underway is a major
mistake. I planning to try my first ship diorama with a ship underway in a
water base and was wondering is there some rule for these - or as I would
expect, do I have to find a picture of the actual ship underway. The
pictures of the remaining Liberty ships underway don't seem to show any such
These also seem absent from any pictures I have seen of the CV Hornet for
example.Thanks in advance.

Val Kraut
Reply to
Val Kraut
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It depends on if they're pumping the bilges out or not, that's what that discharge is. For CV-8 Hornet you do see her with bilges being pumped more often than not but not every bilge outlet will show a discharge. I'd have to go look carefully at the Liberty photos I have before I can say for sure on them.
Reply to
Ron
That depends on the propulsion system in use. Diesel ships discharge cooling water whenever engines are operating, and there could be other cooling discharges for gearboxes etc. as well.
For Val's question, look at photos of the ship you're intending to model and go with what you see : )
Reply to
Jeff C
That is where the shit comes out!!
A Poop Shoot!
Reply to
DDSD
The real crux of the issue for me is - we've all seen streams of water coming out of the sides of a cruise ship or freighter but they don't seem to have such details as the discharge holes on the sides of model ships. Yet in a conversation with a guy who judges the ships categories at shows - he says having no discharge flows on a ship under way is in his mind a sufficient enough omission to drop a model from a Gold to Silver award. Is this guy off on his own high crusade or is there some real ground rule about this?
Val Kraut
Reply to
Val Kraut
I'd say he's heading for Jerusalem.
I don't know that for a fact, because I don't build ships, but consider the size of the detail in question in 1/350 or 1/700. A one-foot-wide discharge stain in 1/350 amounts to 34 thousandths of an inch (.86 mm), or .017 inches (.43mm) in 1/700. Are most of these stains even that wide? It follows that a lot of this stuff is going to be represented overscale, which is also an issue with aircraft, but less of an issue when models are judged on a relative scale (vs. each other) as opposed to an absolute scale (gold/silver/bronze). In absolute terms, the scale is either right or it isn't. One would think this same judge would require adequate crewing of correct scale figures in exposed positions as well, if there is evidence that the ship is underway. Perhaps a little to severe a standard for a gold? Like I said, it's ships, so I'm not sure, and I could see the logic with 1/72 ships, but in the standrad big ship scales?
Mark Schynert
Reply to
Mark Schynert
One would think this same judge would
Mark, The models we were viewing were 1/350th and the ones that had discharge streams used thin wire painted to look like water streams making a kind of arc to the water level. Your comment about crew is interesting. Kik Douglas was quoted as saying the models in "In Harm's Way" looked phoney - no crews on deck. Ever since then I haven't appreciated the movie battle scenes the way I originally did. This is the main reason I'm experimenting with the L'Arsenal figures for the 1/350 carriers, an empty deck with lots of aircraft looks slightly strange to me. Anyway good to hear no one else has this same feelings about the discharge streams so I guess I'll just rely on whatever photos I can get - no hard rules like in some other areas.
Val Kraut
Reply to
Val Kraut
i thought both the naval and air combat in that flic looked fake from day one. the ships were pathetic. where's the detaiing? my war movie will have you guys doing the models.
Reply to
e
I'd say he's an ass......where's the funnel smoke and steam discharge from the vents? Where's the crew? Is there a reasonable signal hoist? Do the guns have tompions in place along with canvas bags over the smaller guns? Are the searchlights turned so the lenses point at the ship? Are the acoomodation ladders properly stowed? Where are the Marines? Are the cranes in the correct positions?..........Yeah, the guy's being an ass.
Reply to
Ron
I forgot one thing in my rant, ships are almost never "wet" enough in dios either.....lots of things besides dischargeto pick at. The guy's being a "I know something but not everything so I'll hammer that one thing nazi".....bet he doesn't care if the wake and wave pattern is correct either.
Reply to
Ron
Val, go to
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and look up the article on wake/wave patterns and remeber ships crusing are wet. L'arsenal crew figures are excellent, I have a slew of them from when Jacques sent me test shots. Make sure the guns are right, if in combat or a combat zone man them, otherwise they should have tompions (barrel plugs for large guns) and canvas bags over 20mm's (pointed straight up with the bag over the gun, rarely the shield, 20mm shields do not pivot vertically), canvas bags usually cover the entire top of 1'1" quads, on 40mm quads usually the muzzles have a bag and the breeches have a bag. Get some signal flags! Make sure you have the national flag flying from the right spot.
What specific ship are you doing?
Reply to
Ron
"> What specific ship are you doing?
I haven't done a ship kit in a while - so plan is to do the Trumpeter Liberty ship - just started it. Then on to the Trumpeter Hornet. Probably work part of the air group in parallel with the Liberty.
Val Kraut
Reply to
Val Kraut
Liberties were weird, their discharge ports usually had semi-circular pipes welded to the hull and when fully laden that pipe was at or below the waterline. Hornet assurdely had exposed bilge discharges and most photos show at least half of them discharging at any given time. They are the lowest holes on the Trumpeter kit. If you're doing her aat the time of the Doolittle Raid keep in mind the seas were 30 feet the day of the launch and for the most part the swells hid the discharge ports.
Reply to
Ron

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