Matt vs. flat black

My recommendation: mix in a bit of "flesh" with the black. This will scale it down, without graying it out. And it will leave you some wiggle room to shade the panel lines, control surfaces, etc.

OR, check out the final color and matte finish Floquil's Grimey Black gives you.

-- Chuck Ryan Springfield OH>

Was the Mossie painted matte black or the colour known as "night" like was used on the hurricanes and beaufighters ? the mix :3pts matte black 1pt matte blue What brand of paint I don't know.

I don't use Tamiya paints so can't comment on how they look on the model, but the charts list three blacks in acrylic or enamel tins, X1 Black - gloss X18 - Semi Gloss Black - satin XF1 -Flat Black - matt

BUT the spraycan chart has: TS6 - Matt Black - matt TS14 - Black - gloss TS29 - Semi Gloss Black - satin

It is interesting that the Tamiya instructions (I've looked at them) call for both XF1 and TS6, so we really need someone who has used both and can tell us if TS6 is more or less matt than XF1.

The tip about toning down the black to dark grey is valid, and is part of the can of worms that is "scale colour". But in order to show some shadow detail, toning the body colour towards dark grey would be right.

As always, get some pictures to refer to if you can. The particular finish you are trying to represent was called "Special Night" and was

De Havilland trials showed that Special Night took 28mph off the top speed of the NFII compared to ordinary Night. From March 1942 (DD-series airframes onwards) NFII's were delivered in Smooth Night, a type S finish. By September 1942 the scheme had changed again, to Medium Sea Grey with a Dark Green camouflage pattern on the top surfaces, type S lustre.

I must admit that I use gloss paints (mostly Xtracolour) to keep the decal film as unobtrusive as possible, then finish with satin varnish (there is such a thing as "scale lustre" as well :-) ). In this case I'd have to start with a flattish satin, mask out the markings and finish the black almost matt. Or get some aftermarket decals for a later airframe in Smooth Night :-)

Ok, these are all good tips. Thanks very much for the help. I'll do a bit of research, but I believe my version calls for Smooth Night.

Cheers, David

Alan Dicey wrote:

Wait a minute- Matt Black was a kid in my old neighborhood- come to think of it, his sister was an a-cup- ; )

Damn...I hope she grew out of it...

If you're using the Tamiya decals, then it's W4087 RS-B of 157 Sqn, one of the first NF II's to be built, and finished overall in Special Night. I don't know if it was later repainted in Smooth Night, but it seems likely once they found out about the performance penalty. If you do go for Smooth Night then barring any photographic evidence to the contrary, I would use the large red centers to the fuselage roundels, and the fin flash with the narrow white band, i.e. national markings as for EG-T. The national markings were modified early in 1942 to make them less conspicuous. Originally the red, white, blue and yellow segments were of equal width, but Bomber Command found that this was too bright when an aircraft was caught by searchlights. Only the W-series NF II's seem to have been delivered with the early, bright roundels, and the instruction to modify them was sent out at the end of January 1942. The rest of the RAF adopted the new roundels in May. (info from Paul Lucas's Combat Colours books 5 and 6, which deal with the Mosquito)

Lucas says that Special Night persisted on bombers (all bombers) until the end of 1942, when it was withdrawn in favour of Smooth Night.

Doing a Special Night finish could be interesting, as it apparantly rubbed off weathered areas revealing the smooth Night undercoat - weathering with varnishes!

gimmie a cuppa a bird in the hand anyone have a,,,

i got nothing here.

This is a terminology thing. The technical term for flat is Lambertian reflector. It is impossible to obtain a pure reflection distribution like that in the real world.

Also, it is impossible to obtain a black with true zero reflectivity. Matt paints try as hard as possible to approach a true lambertian distribution (the opposite of shiny). Paint companies try to make black as low a reflectance as possible. Best blacks are about 2% reflectance. This is fine because very little in nature has a truly zero surface reflectivity. So I usually add some white to flat black anyway (Testors has a neat "rubber" color with just a touch of brown- very nice). I restrict a true flat black for painting openings that I don't actually open up (like end of exhaust pipes).

I paint my black ....with tamiya matt black........then I apply a layer of oils ."lamp black"or "Mars black".......then i lightly rub off with a soft cloth...........it fills in the structural lines on the model adding depth ...I then dry brush,,,with a lighter base colour ...also oils .....they dry brush so easily ...............with decals i spray the place with a gloss spray .........apply the decals .............set for about 24 hours ....spray the whole model with a matt finish ......for oils ..............very good results

Very nice techniques. Oils are marvelous. I use a similar method to paint leather. I paint the object a good, "ruddy" matt flesh tone. After good and dry, I cover it in full strength dark brown, black, or a mixture, etc. Let it set for a half hour or so, then "dry brush" most of it away.

Ahh...now look what you did... You went and made me think. I hate it when that happens!

Doug Wagner

I'm midway through the NF Mossie, still adding interior detail. Made the mistake of cutting the flaps. to lower them (DOH !!!) but everything else is fine. Getting another kit and will finish it. Resin cockpit taking a lot of time now :)

I think I will give your procedure a try. Sounds right like I was thinking a while ago, just didn't have it all figured out. Thanx ...

Allan