Toys or Models?

I have a quick response for people like that, I would have simply asked him where he dumped his golf clubs. To me those are just toy also.

In reallity, any item or device beyond what is a necessity is essentially a toy. Look at our modern world of cellphones, digital cameras, DVD players, all the sports equipment, plasma TVs, and countless thousands of other examples. None of these are honestly necessary in conducting our everyday life (although many might think so today!) - they are just high priced toys we find ways of justifying.

Personally, I consider my model railroading efforts as a form of three dimensional art, since perfecting the backdrop and scenery is as important to me as having trains to run through it. In a sense I guess it is a form of folk art and there are more than a few individuals in _that_ field who are held in great respect and their pursuits would never be considered as childish.

CNJ999

I agree with the fact many things are toys. I guess my boss would have thought that trains were toys where say a boat was not. I could see his logic that children have trains while few would own a boat. I couldn't use the golf deal on him because he didn't play. He bought old cars, rebuilt them and sold them at a profit, that was his hobby. My main question was should there be a difference between say a Lionel boxcar, 027 traditional size, and a scale HO boxcar when it comes to paying the UP trademark fee. I think there should not be. Just curious if any thought there should be and why.

Jerry

So who's to say what's a toy and what's not? Is it if a child owns it is a toy? and if an adult owns it, it is a model?

I owned some models back when I was 3-4... Sure it was bachmann and bachmann plus, but it was still "model" trains. So are they going to suddenly decide what's a toy and what's not so they can tax those of us who get joy from them, as children do their toys?

just my thinking on this one

Thanks

Brandon

The only difference between men and boys is the price of the toys.

:-) :-) :-)

Remember too...when the golfer can no longer swing his club due to old age and his only golf pursuit then becomes watching PGA on the boob tube, we'll still be doing what we love to...maybe we'll need a helpful hand with layout framing construction, but we'll still be able to have our hand on the throttle.

Cheers, enjoy and play.

Bill Sohl

I've seen lots of rich old guys who collect and show off their models.

Usually at restaurants and nightclubs...

Jeff Sc. Ba-bump!, Ga.

paying the UP trademark fee< I believe the US government sees a difference between the two on import duty but that may have changed long ago. Back in the early days of brass it became a battle ground for importers which the brass importers finally won.

In the big scheme of things if it is an object that is unnecessary for sustenance it is probably a "toy" regardless of who the owner is. I am certain we all have more toys than we think about. e.g.. --> TV.

But the original question of when does a toy become a model, is harder to answer. It probably comes down to the intention of the object. Is is primary purpose to simply symbolize the real thing or accurately represent it? An architect would need a "model" building to represent his work rather than a "toy" doll house (open at the back with a single width floor plan). In the model railroad world it gets even more fuzzy when one is talking about things like Lionel vs say an HO Kadee box car. Grown people "play" with both for enjoyment. To me Lionel is much more in the toy category, but one could argue that the Kadee is just a "better" model than the Lionel.

If I was to become interested in a particular bocxar, and was to research that boxcar , then go out and find an example of a boxcar, photograph it, measure it, go home and produce an accurate scale drawing of it, use that drawing to make an accurate replica of it to a consistent scale, I would call that a model.

If on the other hand, I was to grab a lump of wood, carve it to the approximate shape of a boxcar, paint it and and letter it with whatever was to hand, without any reference to a real boxcar, I would call that a toy.

A link was posted recently to a UP logo-ed nerf train. You recently wrote "I have seen toys trains with stick on decals that say UP. Look like cheap crap." Can you genuinely not distinguish the difference between a toy and a model?

=>Jerry wrote: =>

=>> I see no reason for the so called "model" view. My opinion has =>> always been if you own a train and you can hold it in your hand, it =>> is in reality a toy. =>

=>If I was to become interested in a particular bocxar, and was to =>research that boxcar , then go out and find an example of a boxcar, =>photograph it, measure it, go home and produce an accurate scale drawing =>of it, use that drawing to make an accurate replica of it to a =>consistent scale, I would call that a model.

All models are toys, but not all toys are models.

Why so sensitive about the word "toy"? Do you think toys are for children? OK, so we're kids in size 10 shoes. What's wrong with that?

Wolf Kirchmeir ................................. If you didn't want to go to Chicago, why did you get on this train? (Garrison Keillor)

As I said, if it is a train and you can hold it in your hand it is a toy. There may be good accurate toys or cheap crappy toys but they are still toys. Just because you like the word model so it makes you feel more adult does not change the fact they are still toys and the majority of the worlds population would agree. Jerry

As are these devices that we write these messages on.

Eventhough computers can run some extremely complex business software, the mass majority of computers in this country are used for "recreation", including many of those that are supposed to be used for business. I've known many people over the years who used "chat" programs, or played online games or the built in "solitaire" or other games while at work on their computers.

Don't get me started on cellullar/wireless phones...probably the biggest TOY ever invented for adults. Especially those with built in internet, photo capability and game playing. Nothing but a Gameboy for adults.

Absolutely correct Wolf. I once heard that the difference between a man and a boy was the price of his toy. Jerry

I wondered how long it would be before that card got played...

One could justify just about anything by claiming the majority of the world's population would agree - you'll have to do better than that.

Oh, well, that's an absolutely irrefutable bit of wisdom, so that's me well and truly sorted out...

It's not so much that I am sensitive to the word toy, more that I'm unwilling to accept a definition of my hobby that is imposed by those outside the hobby. Or in the case of Jerry, a blow-in intent only on trolling. I don't understand why so many model railroaders are willing to take on board what others think about their pursuits.

And yes, I think that toys are for children. I'm an elitist, remember?

Yes Mark you are using toys because, as you have already alluded too, you are a cheap bastard. Jerry

So the word toy bothers you. Too bad. Most of the world would agree. Now I grant you that you might have accurate toys but they are still toys. When I had HO they were toys, Genesis and all. The O scale is considered toys too. It's all the same. Grow up boy and accept it Jerry

Makes me wonder what you would call the 12" gauge or smaller live steam trains. If you try to hold one in your hand, you will soon have some very flat fingers...

Paul A. Cutler III