LMS Twins

Was a spectator on the early tussle as to who does a Blue thingy, but now its serious with LMS twins ! If it was just Hattons then would swallow something and go for it, but now
its Hattons with Dapol or Rails with Bachmann. Now Dapol are due Feb 2011 but Bachmann early 2012. Then again this is Bachmann we are talking about so it could be ..... Bachmann price is reasonable but assume Dapol is similar. Unless either do something daft - not unknown - then quality/accuracy equivalent but dont know till arrive. For me will be Rails of course, but how would others decide ? Should it be pre-ordered allowing for wanting the LMS one.
As an aside, it does seem with so many limited editions of new types the development costs of new locos has dropped even if its only for boxes (ok diesels), the numbers produced seems very low. realise that some locos are only with original seller for short while, but manufacturer is having to wait extra time before getting development costs bac.
cheers, Simon
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I like this line from Rails....
"We have been given invaluable assistance from a gentleman who worked on the construction of the Twins at Derby and he has supplied a huge number of photographs that have identified many differences and changes that are not documented elsewhere, even in the most authoritative of publications."
It is a poke in the eye answer to give to rivet counters criticising some miniscule detail of your model.
Dezzi
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Hmm, that never came out as I composed it, I had underlined "not documented elsewhere, even in the most authoritative of publications."
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On 04/08/2010 09:29, Dezzi wrote: [...]

Did you use shift - underline _like this_?
cheers, wolf k.
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No, I had underlined a whole sentence. I had composed it in MS Word and cut and pasted it, but the formatting wasn't retained.
Dezzi
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Usenet is designed to be a plain text only medium, so all of your formatting is automatically stripped. In any case, useful retention of styling information when using the clipboard is hit and miss in general - even between MS Office applications - and not to be relied on.
Some pointers for how to imply emphasis on certain things on usenet:-
_This is underlined_
/This is in italics/
*This is bold*
It's generally best, if you really /have/ to emphasise something to keep the 'highlighted' block short to maintain readablility. Note that 'SHOUTING' (typing normal words in block capitals) is considered bad form by most people and can be tricky to read.
HTH!
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Ahh, gotcha, Cheers, Dezzi.
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SNIP
SNIP
Accept its still marketing but Dick Flower of rails and MRemag fame appears an honourable chap. However it doesnt show up on nearly all photos then being interested in essence rather than rivetts, not too fussed about that.
cheers, Simon
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I wasn't referring to Rails or Dick Flower or anything in the context of the article it was in, I was simply saying that "differences and changes that are not documented elsewhere" is a good reply to someone who is saying your model doesn't resemble the prototype.
Dezzi.
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Apologies if seemed that way, wasnt intending to suggest you were. I wonder if Mr Flower said it to get people to wait for Rails one or to delay Dapol by sending them scurrying back to photos and a modified design :-)
Cheers, Simon
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On 04/08/2010 08:53, simon wrote:

[...]
Limited editions of locomotives are possible because they vary mostly in livery and details. The former are relatively easy to vary these days, the latter are cheaper than they used to be because details are nowadays add-on parts. If the variation is merely the loco's name and number, it's very cheap to make it. That's why some dealers/wholesalers can arrange to have exclusive limited editions.
That being said, the numbers produced depend more and more on the pre-orders. Dealers will order a number on spec, but even so, minimum production will have to be a couple gross, but two gross (188 pieces) may be a large number for a special edition locomotive with limited appeal.
Over-ordering specialised items over here in the past resulted in sell-offs of surplus stock at below wholesale prices, and an expectation that if you waited long enough, you could buy your favourite loco at a bargain price.
Well, that's no longer the case. Here, limited editions have become almost entirely a matter of pre-orders: if the maker doesn't get enough, then the item is cancelled. Conversely, the number made will be very close to the number pre-ordered, so that if you didn't pre-order, you may not get the item at all. Eg, a recent production of CPRail cabooses was sold out before it even arrived in Canada.(One of my customers wanted one as soon as he saw it, but by then it was too late, all the ones I had were spoken for.) I'll wager the same trend will show up in the UK, if it hasn't already.
So if you want the LMS one, my advice is pre-order it.
cheers, wolf k.
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Thinking more of the recent cases where theres only one run of the loco type and thats it.

Never keen on the first run, thats when more serious problems are likely to show up - same with software, always wait a few months before upgrading. However, as you say, if want LMS and thats only certain in first run, then will have to take it.
Cheers, Simon
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<snip>

I wonder how whoever it is that's bringing out the Q6 will handle the vacuum ejector pipe - only the preserved one ever had one and IIRC that was fitted less than ten years ago (Dad and I saw them working on it).
Considering that the manufacturers are really scraping the bottom of the diesel barrel now I'd expect to see quite a few pre-grouping designs coming through in the next year or so.
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/is/ a real email address!
Dont know about pre-grouping, you would be lucky to put together a pre 1935 layout with RTR - in LMS at least. Got a range of locos but not with correct livery. Are they doing the ROD in anything other than BR ?
Cheers, Simon
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Bring back the Hornby 2P and Deeley 3F ! I have an original "Midlander" set in the loft for which I repainted first-of-class no. 3775 in 1907 goods red and a IIRC 2P de-rebuilt to Johnson condition with Plastikard, in lined Midland crimson lake :) Also a 43775 in black and (not R-T-R) a whitemetal Kirtley 0-6-0 (K's?). Reliable old chassis, those Triang-Hornby 0-6-0's !
Have a part built Johnson 2-4-0 as well somewhere ...
Nick
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OH yeah - and those brass outside cranks are a *sod* to quarter ...
Nick
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wrote:

Most of my kit built ex LNWR and Midland are in 1920's livery, but if its RTR then its around 1935. Dont you have a crimson Compound - isnt that in Midland livery ?
CHeers, Simon
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Don't have a Compound, no. I had the two MR locos since I was a lad, so I kind of settled on 1907 as that is when 3775 was built so it could be no earlier. The 1907 Compounds were very different looking, much more Edwardian beasts.
It was a great period for the modeller as it was a time of changeover in centuries, CMEs, operating practice, and design styles (even livery). So loads of opportunity for bashing R-t-R around on my favourite railway :)
The MR R-T-R bodyshells were a great base for detailing and rebuilding into related locos for the novice we all started as ...
Nick
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<snip>

It's a bit better with LNER in general, the Gresley LNER Group Standard designs have been particularly well covered by Bachmann but there isn't a great deal of pre-grouping stuff.
Regarding livery, LNER modellers are somewhat more fortunate as after the 1928 painting economies the liveries remained the same until during WW2. Isn't an additional complication with the LMS that big renumbering scheme they did around the 30s?
On Thorpe Thewles (a station near Stockton, LNER 1923-1939) we have the following RTR engines that would fit a pre-1935 period:-
K3 no. 2934, the one on which Bachmann forgot most of the lining. That particular engine went to traffic in September 1934 but the tooling is good for ones built after No. 135 in February 1925.
J39 no. 1467, this is actually a repainted BR one but I think Bachmann have brought them out in LNER livery before. Class introduced 1926.
While our V1 No. 466 is a Wills / Nu-Cast kit, Bachmann have brought this engine out RTR before. To traffic October 1936, but class introduced 1930.
A1 No. 4475 Flying Fox. Hornby with Great Northern tender, condition as modelled covers period September 1934 - June 1935 and March 1937 - February 1942 if I've interpreted the table in RCTS 2A correctly.
A3 No. 2505 Cameronian. Hornby (Ringfield). To traffic October 1934, originally had 'New-Type' non-corridor tender, GN tender after November 1936. I have a sneaky feeling that Hornby made ours with a corridor tender, which would be incorrect, but it's been a while since I've seen it.
Everything else is kit-built, mainly Dave Alexander ones.
The only NER engine available RTR is Bachmann's J72 and the chassis is well overdue a re-work even if you don't use DCC. Hornby is the usual story of random shunters or huge pacifics and nothing in between.
Someone's brought out an N2, in GNR livery. Looks lovely, but even if they did it in LNER livery it's out of region for us. Rather have a G5.

Bachmann are listing it under catalogue ref. 31-003, the livery being LNER black (number on cab) which is good for roughly 1928-1939 or possibly longer depending on when it got repainted during WW2. Its number of 6190 is good for roughly 1924-1946. I suspect it's one of the Great Central ones, and I'm not familiar enough with the class to comment on the detail on the actual model.
They're also listing a GWR version under catalogue number 31-129 but no release date as yet.
Bachmann's Era scheme is bollocks anyway, Era 3 covers at least four reasonably long-lived LNER livery periods (24-28, 28-39ish, WW2, post-WW2) and it's daft seeing the A2 'A. H. Peppercorn' lumped in the same period as the Robinson O4.
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/is/ a real email address!
Era scheme also has the problem of trying to remember which era is which.
Ignoring the initial experiments and partial cover ups of pre-1928, there were 4 different sets of standard liveries on LMS until 1948. The insignia colours changed so wether a loco was Red, lined or plain black didnt matter. Suspect theres only a Crab and Fowler 4P tank RTR in pre-1935 as they were first produced in LMS red then changed to lined black when repainted after 1930.
Cheers, Simon
Cheers, Simon
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